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POETRYETC  2003

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Subject:

Re: Sir Thomas Browne

From:

Anny Ballardini <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Poetryetc provides a venue for a dialogue relating to poetry and poetics <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sat, 21 Jun 2003 15:16:09 +0200

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (144 lines)

If reincarnation exists, I bet they forced us out of it all...
While looking for the last local execution, which I could not find but I
know took place quite late, maybe it touches the XXth century, I found the
following link in Italian,

http://www.notizieufo.com/satan88.htm

just translated the paragraph regarding the beginning of the Inquisition to
remember,

The birth of the Saint Inquisition (officially "against or to prevent
 heresy") dates back to 1184, year in which in each diocese an episcopal
inquisition - later on centralized after the IVth Lateran Council IV
(1215) - it was stated that repression against heresy was law for the
Church. It was thus that in 1231 pope Gregory IX instituted by the
Christians courts of justice presided over by Dominicans and/or Franciscans.
Even if there are proceeds of the trials against witches referred to in
1300, it was only in 1478 that pope Sisto IV started in the Iberian land,
and after specific request by the sovereigns Ferdinando and Isabella, the
fierce Spanish Inquisition (one of its most cruel executors was the
Dominican Tomas de Torquemada. This inquisition was the main persecutor of
the Jews, of the "enlightened mystics" or heretics, of the Protestants and,
in America, of the Indians suspected of idolatry). In Italy it was only in
1542 that the Roman (or Sant'Uffizio) Inquisition was born, directed by pope
Paul III to fight against the Protestant Reformation, and later, witchcraft.
With the publication in 1484 of the Summis desiderantes by pope Innocenzo
VIII, credited was the belief that the witches could harm cattle, harvest
and pregnancies.
_____________

I don't have here the book of reference, but it should be thanks to Sisto IV
(or was it a pope before him) that people thought that Jews had a tail
hidden under their trousers and hooves instead of feet, Papal bull legally
used by Hitler at the beginning of the Holocaust, various centuries later.
:-(
a

From: "Mark Weiss" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>


> Right you are. The last execution was in the 18th century.
>
> Mark
>
>
> At 08:10 AM 6/21/2003 +0100, you wrote:
> >my memory ever shaky shakey? remembers that the last trial for witchcraft
> >was around 1944!!in england- to silence a woman who foretold navy
> >secrets??????cheers patrick someone correct me!!!!!!
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: Mark Weiss <[log in to unmask]>
> >To: <[log in to unmask]>
> >Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2003 12:05 AM
> >Subject: Re: Sir Thomas Browne
> >
> >
> > > The last English trial for witchcraft was in the mid-eighteenth
> > > century.  Very few of Browne's scientific contemporaries were willing
to
> > > state with a certainty that witches didn't exist.
> > >
> > > In Cuba, which has one of the world's highest literacy rates and a
> > > first-class scientific establishment the majority of bthe population
> > > follows santeria, of which witchcraft is an essential component.
> > >
> > > But why go far afield? I live in California.
> > >
> > > And is it stranger to believe that there's a diety, or that the diety
> >begot
> > > on a mortal adolescent a child given to magic tricks?
> > >
> > > Mark
> > >
> > >
> > > At 06:48 PM 6/20/2003 -0400, you wrote:
> > > >At 10:03 PM 6/20/2003 +0100, you wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> > Alas I remembered Sir Thomas and his "thing" about witchcraft.
> > > >>
> > > >>I've been trying desperately to remember the link between Browne and
> > > >>witchcraft, Kenneth, but damned if I can call it to mind.  Maybe you
or
> >Mark
> > > >>could save my ass here?
> > > >
> > > >I wish I could quote chapter & verse on this.  SOMEwhere in Religio
> >Medici,
> > > >Browne has a relatively brief passage on his absolute belief in the
> > > >presence of witches.  It stuck with me only because it struck me as
> >totally
> > > >anomalous for a man of medicine and science to buy into the
> > > >occult.  Somewhere I have a copy of Wayne Shumaker's "The Occult
Sciences
> > > >in the Renaissance": if I can dig it out I might have some luck
locating
> >a
> > > >reference.  I have long since lost the Thomas Browne book--it
traveled
> >with
> > > >me from Binghamton and around various residences in New Jersey;
probably
> >it
> > > >was one of my books that got destroyed by mildew from sitting in a
garage
> > > >because we didn't have proper storage space.  I know--I shiver at
that
> >too.
> > > >
> > > >>But surely against the born-again credulity, there's the Pseudoxia
> > > >>Epidemica?  Browne the debunker ...
> > > >>
> > > >>He wasn't as hyped on witches as Jimmy the Six and One, though.
> > > >
> > > >Or for that matter the ladies and gentlemen among the Puritans
> > > >(Congregationalists?) who brought us the spectacle of Salem, MA.  I
once
> > > >was friendly with a woman who was a direct descendant through her
> >father's
> > > >side of the family of the Coreys, Giles and Martha: he who was
pressed to
> > > >death for refusing to plead to the charge, she who died on the
> > > >gallows.  This woman told me when she showed up at the museum in
Salem
> >some
> > > >years ago, they treated her like visiting royalty.
> > > >
> > > >I have less than no idea when the strong belief in "spirits" died
> > > >out.  Though I know a guy whose wife is a Wicca practitioner, so
maybe
> >it's
> > > >not dead yet.
> > > >
> > > >Ken
> > > >
> > > >-----------------------------
> > > >Kenneth Wolman  http://www.kenwolman.com
> >http://kenwolman.blogspot.com
> > > >Lord, steel us against the expectation of disappointment and our
belief
> >in
> > > >the certainty of heartbreak....
>

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