"Z" not "C."  Another error.

Oh and to confuse things further, I found this:

'Correction:

..regarding the 1982 piece by Amos Oz conjecturing on what an interview with
the real Ariel Sharon would reveal. Quotes and article were published last
week in the Minneapolis Star Tribune and other newspapers, and other
sources, attributing the quote/s directly to General Sharon.. Let the record
show that: The Interview by Amos Oz was published in Dec of 1982 in the
popular Israeli newspaper, Davar. And The Interview was at least in part
created by Amos Oz from his knowledge and of what was said and believed by
Sharon and cohorts and attributed at the time to "Officer Z" who was then
said by many to be Sharon himself. It was not however an actual interview
with Sharon and in fact may have been with another Israeli officer, or a
composite of some kind. All this was quickly brought to our attention so we
are quickly bringing it all to your attention.'

From:
http://www.flashpoints.net/

Not an actual interview, hmm?  Very Ossianic/Macphersonian of Oz.
Fascinating.

What gets even more complicated is that the above quote is also on
http://www.middleeast.org/ verbatim, and neither site credits the other.
The above clarification has its own issues of authenticity....

Patrick


-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick Herron [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2002 1:03 AM
To: Poetryetc provides a venue for a dialogue relating to poetry and
poetics
Subject: RE: Amos Oz


Thank you for this clarification Alison.   The person who sent me the quote
is a professor who also mentioned there were issues of authenticity
surrounding the quote but he wasn't able to provide more information, even
after I pushed it.  I think he just could not remember.  The use of a letter
by Oz to name the interviewee now makes it clear to me why there is some
controversy.  I did not know that exactly.

I apologize for not bringing up this issue of authenticity.  I was hoping
that if it came up, someone else would bring it up.  It's a whole other can
of worms, and I'm trying very hard these days to avoid cans of worms on
lists these days.  Alas, it is in my nature to get entangled in
vermicomposting receptacles even when I try to avoid them.

"C."  Once again a name is but a variable, a place holder, albeit a highly
valued one.

I should add that attributing this quote to Sharon is commonly accepted and
has been accepted as such.  To my knowledge it is not a foregone conclusion
that it is not Ariel Sharon.  Without Oz's clarification none of us can
know.  Has Amos ever revealed his source?  I imagine of the interviewee were
now deceased there wouldn't be much harm in revealing his identity.  I guess
I'm not taking Holger Jensen's words at face value either.

I wonder if Oz was considered irresponsible or immoral for interviewing
people but then not revealing their names.  Fascinating.


Best,
Patrick

Patrick Herron
[log in to unmask]

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!Getting Close Is What!
! We're All About(TM) !
!http://proximate.org/!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-----Original Message-----
From: Poetryetc provides a venue for a dialogue relating to poetry and
poetics [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Alison Croggon
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2002 10:23 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Amos Oz


It occurred to me that the simplest thing would be to check with Amos Oz, so
I've written to the international editor of Christian Science Monitor to see
if he can pass on the question.  I'll let you know if there's any response.


Best


A


As with the problems raised by the "killer Jews" phrase in the "Ramallah"
poem (and clearly some of Clark's best friends are Jewish) , I'd suggest
that this is a very important time to be as accurate as possible. If one
scrolls further down the IPB web page with the "Sharon"--Oz dialogue,, one
finds the following  (nor do I think it is useful to claim to know another's
'thinking,' as the IPB editor claims below, apart from his or hers words and
actions):

Errata 18th April 2002
We picked up the interview and checked as far as possible that it was
authentic; the interview was published in the Davar paper as stated, and we
took the assurances of people who know Amos Oz, the journalist who conducted
the interview, that the person identified as "C" was Ariel Sharon. There has
since been a lively discussion that some of the descriptions of the
interviewee do not fit with Sharon, even though the opinions mentioned match
his thinking. Many journalists took the claim that it was Sharon at face
value, as did for example the editor of Rocky Mountain News who just issued
the following statement:
CORRECTION: A MEA CULPA
By Holger Jensen, Scripps Howard News Service, 4/15/02
This is a mea culpa. I made a grievous error in not verifying the
authenticity of 20-year-old quotes attributed to Ariel Sharon that I used in
my April 12 column on the Israeli leader. As it turns out, they were made
not by Sharon but another unnamed Israeli soldier who died 11years ago. The
interview in question was conducted by Amos Oz, one of Israel's leading
authors and prominent in the Peace Now movement. He had access to many
Israeli generals and politicians of that era but identified some of his
interview subjects only by letters of the alphabet, leaving it up to his
readers to decide who they were...
(Holger Jensen is international editor of the Rocky Mountain News. E-mail:
[log in to unmask])
Comment 19th April 2002
The following comment was sent in from one of our readers:
Dear IPB,
I think it looks like: From the North and From The West by Mordechai (Motta)
Gur, Israel Ministry of Defense Press, 272 pages. (Ma'arachot). Hebrew title
is Mitzafon u-MiYam. The late Motta Gur was Chief of the General Staff of
the Israel Defense Forces from 1974-1978. He is famed for announcing "The
Temple Mount is Ours," (Har HaBayit BeYaDaynu) in the 1967 War, while
commanding the brigade that took back Jerusalem. He is also famous for
humiliating General Ariel Sharon. Born in Jerusalem in 1930, he entered the
Gadna/Palmach at age 13, and served in the IDF until his death. These books
which will one day be translated into English hopefully, illuminate Israel's
history from the POV of this mythic top echelon officer. See also his books
'Fouth Battalion' and 'The Temple Mount is Ours'.
Islamic Party of Britain Date: 18 April 2002 [log in to unmask]


--

"The only real revolt is the revolt against war."
                                    Albert Camus

Alison Croggon
Home page
http://www.users.bigpond.com/acroggon/

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http://au.geocities.com/masthead_2/