We are not allowed to social network fullstop
Tim Grubb - HER Officer
Gloucestershire County Council Archaeology Service
Shire Hall, Westgate Street, Gloucester. GL1 2TH
Tel - 01452 425705
Email - [log in to unmask]
Web - www.gloucestershire.gov.uk/archaeology
HER Enquiries. www.gloucestershire.gov.uk/her
Go to www.gloucestershire.gov.uk to find information on any County Council service. It couldn't be easier to find information instantly and in some cases apply for services online.
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of David Evans
Sent: 09 May 2012 08:48
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Engagement workshop
Odd
We can access flickr and twitter but not facebook!
David Evans
Historic Environment Record Officer
(Postal Address)
Strategic Planning Policy & Specialist Advice
Department of Environment and Community Services
PO Box 2081
The Council Offices, Castle Street
Thornbury
South Gloucestershire
BS35 9BP
Phone: 01454 863649
fax: 01454 864473
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of GRUBB, Tim
Sent: 09 May 2012 07:51
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Engagement workshop
...if only we could access Flickr
Tim Grubb - HER Officer
Gloucestershire County Council Archaeology Service
Shire Hall, Westgate Street, Gloucester. GL1 2TH
Tel - 01452 425705
Email - [log in to unmask]
Web - www.gloucestershire.gov.uk/archaeology
HER Enquiries. www.gloucestershire.gov.uk/her
Go to www.gloucestershire.gov.uk to find information on any County
Council service. It couldn't be easier to find information instantly and
in some cases apply for services online.
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of NEWMAN, Martin
Sent: 09 May 2012 07:50
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Engagement workshop
I've added you as a contact on Flickr Brian.
I thought I'd share some Flickr links that Forum members might find
interesting:
Swindon Central Library has a very good and regularly updated photo
stream mainly with scans of old photographs
http://www.flickr.com/photos/swindonlocal/
EH has used Flickr for Heritage at risk with a specific groups for the
most recent theme of industrial heritage at risk
http://www.flickr.com/groups/industrialheritageatrisk/ and Buildings at
Risk http://www.flickr.com/groups/buildingsatrisk/
Martin
________________________________________
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records
[[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brian Giggins
[[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 5:39 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [HERFORUM] Engagement workshop
Having retired I have endeavoured to dabble in the 'social media' to
promote the history of the Towcester and some of my research in to
Northamptonshire buildings Initially I was very impressed with a
Facebook group called 'Northampton past' which now has over 2500
members. The members posted old photographs of the town and others
commented on them. So in parallel I started a 'Towcester History and
photographs' group, put details in the local history society newsletter.
the local NN12 Website and a poster in the library - total membership 33
(some of which are family and none are from the Local History Society!).
I put good historic detail with the pictures which a a few friends
comment on or 'like' but few others do. Sadly I seldom now put material
of the Northampton past site as the membership seem seldom interested in
material before the Victorians but delight in nostalgia - which is
perfectly valid .
Recently I have used Flickr to put on about 50 dated buildings in
Northamptonshire from 1611 to 1913 which I thought could be useful for
those interested in vernacular architecture -
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lactoduro/sets/72157629874852499/ . They
were linked to 3 Flickr groups containing over 3500 members. It doesn't
take long to realise that the proportion of Flckr members wanting their
material to be seen vastly outnumbers those looking for images.
My very limited experience in Northamptonshire so far suggests that
local heritage material has a limited appeal on social media unless it
has a high nostalgia content and many of the members of Northamptonshire
local history societies, where much of the interest in Local Heritage
interest lies, will not touch social media with a 'barge pole'. It is
therefore important not to rely on web material alone. What possibly
needs to be considered are the benefits of regularly commenting on
Heritage material put forward by others on the social media as well as
generating it yourself.
Regards
Brian Giggins
On 8 May 2012 11:50, Roderick Millard
<[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
I wasn't at the seminar (or following it over the ether), but I'm going
to wade in with a few thoughts of my own on the use of social media:
Instead of just looking at the proportions of people who access YouTube,
Twitter, and Facebook (or, as I like to call them "You-Twit-Face") it
may be more relevant to consider the demographics. Many of them
(particularly regular users) are younger professionals or students, who
are less likely to engage in "traditional" outreach programs, but will
take part in online surveys and email petitions - all without leaving
the comfort of their living room/office/basement [delete as
appropriate].
While this has been used to great effect for national (or international)
protest, community groups are starting to realise its potential for
local issues as well - you are starting to get campaigns opposing Tesco
stores or to save particular landmarks from demolition. So clearly the
"twitterati" care about the character of their local area, but are not
being engaged by traditional means - while many (mostly) older activists
are participating in the usual public enquiries etc. but are not being
engaged online (if they even have internet access).
In these circumstances, it is all too easy to say that because one or
other demographic did not engage in the process, they did not care about
the issue (something our elected leaders have been known to use to ram
through proposals in the past). But the only way to get truly
representative response is to do outreach through multiple streams -
including face-to-face research, public participation events, AND social
media. The more streams we use, the more representative the responses
will be.
All of which is a very long winded way of saying that while social media
should never REPLACE traditional outreach activities, it is increasingly
necessary to use the two approaches in parallel, otherwise we risk not
just alienating but entirely omitting a sizable chunk of the population
who we would not normally reach.
Rod Millard
HER Officer
Bath & North East Somerset Council
________________________________________
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records
[[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>] On Behalf Of
Peter Insole
[[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>]
Sent: 02 May 2012 14:53
To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Engagement workshop
I would like to apologise to David on behalf of English Heritage if you
were misled in anyway about the concept behind the workshop.
And in response to both you and Jenny, as I said in my rant on Friday,
at no point was the suggestion that social media should replace
traditional means of out reach. A variety of media or channels are
required so that our processes are inclusive and transparent. The
afternoon scenarios actually proposed a variety of tools for engagement
from high tech to no tech and the work groups' outcomes all used a
variety of each to achieve the fictitious goals.
The aim of the day was to demonstrate how social media can be a very
useful tool (or series of tools) where appropriate. I personally think
that social media such as flickr, facebook, soundcloud/audioboo etc can
be useful tools to capture a process or event to engage a wider audience
and broadcast or disseminate the results as opposed to writing up a
report and publishing a document on the web or as a leaflet. This would
be particularly useful in an on-going process like a Conservation Area
Appraisal or Neighbourhood Plan. I'm going to put this into practice as
part of one of our current Conservation Area Character Appraisals where
I'll be using twitter before, during and after a public event along with
soundcloud to capture people's oral testimonies. This will not replace
the written word, final document, traditional press etc, but I believe
it will explore the potential to reach a wider audience with minimal
resource implications for me (which was the other point of the workshop
- to demonstrate that these tools do not have to mean huge amounts of
extra work for HEROs).
Since I started using twitter I have become aware of many links to
sources of information or projects that I would not have otherwise seen.
Incidentally, on a similar issue if we are trying to be inclusive and we
accept that not everyone has a computer it is interesting that Bristol
City Council almost always use a paper free consultation approach using
the Ask Bristol resource http://www.bristol.gov.uk/page/have-your-say
Best wishes,
Peter Insole
Archaeological Officer
City Development (Urban Design and Conservation)
Neighbourhoods and City Development
BristolCity Council
Brunel House
St.Georges Road
Bristol, BS1 5UY
www.bristol.gov.uk/citydesigngroup<http://www.bristol.gov.uk/citydesigng
roup>
www.bristol.gov.uk/knowyourplace<http://www.bristol.gov.uk/knowyourplace
>
Tel: 0117 9223033
Fax: 0117 9224637
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>>> Jenny Hall <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>>
02/05/2012 11:27 >>>
I didn't attend the session so hope I am not speaking out of turn, but
have I am particularly aware of the pressures to use digital technology
in interpretation.
There are many opportunities through using social media/ techonology and
these shold always be explored but we should not pat ourselves on the
back and say we are reaching everyone. Each Facebook page or Smart
phones app will reach a certain group of people but it has to be seen as
exclusive, for all sorts of reasons: cost, desire, technology etc.
Exclusivity/inclusivity used to be key components of all sorts of work,
but the terms aren't mentioned when digital technology is part of the
mix.
Only 50 % of people have a Smart Phone, ony 30 million people have a
Facebook account - half the population. As David Evans says these are
just figures and they aren't scrutinised. I have a Facebook account but
I rarely use it, and the majority of my friends on Facebook rarely use
it either, so we are part of that 30million but probably wouldn't engage
in any project through it. Encouraging people to use social media
sometimes works and sometimes doesn't, and just as in a meeting it is
still the certain people who are heard most loudly
----- Original Message -----
From: David Evans
To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2012 10:22 AM
Subject: Engagement workshop
On Luddites the 200th anniversary of the attack on Rawfords Mill is on
the 11th April - sledgehammers welcome.
Unlike Bob Jones I am not Luddite - a Rebecca perhaps - but I do not
have a smart phone or any other such device and don't intend to have
one. I don't need to tell people I am on the train - I know that.
The original publicity for the workshop appeared to be a debate about
public engagement but that is not what we got. If I had seen the
programm earlier I almost certainly would not have gone. I am not
convinced by the argument that the silent majority will get a voice
through social media - this was certainly implied. The noisy certainly
succeeded in the workshop.
Everyone does not have a computer.
1 In the short term yes in the longer term hopefully no.
2 The fact that there are 30 million UK users of Facebook and 26
million UK users of Twitter means that there are 30 million UK users of
Facebook and 26 million UK users of Twitter nothing more; nothing less.
They might have a use but it is limited and the workshop did not
demonstrate any expanded use. As I said before Flicker will be of
immense use in compiling, for example local lists
3 If you are doing a Conservation Area assessment then postal
information (thank you GIS) and meetings with the people involved, even
(horror horror) cold calls, a blog might help, however most blogs are
for fanatics and self publicists.
4 Surely Know Your Place a traditional website (traditional and website
in the same sentence) where instead of emailing the site you can add
things to a map, Yes social media may have a place but then so does
quantum computing
I still feel the day could have been handled better replacing the
useless afternoon session.
In reply to your discussion point - perhaps
Incidentally why are we left with pieces of paper from the day?
David Evans
Historic Environment Record Officer
(Postal Address)
Strategic Planning Policy & Specialist Advice
Department of Environment and Community Services
PO Box 2081
The Council Offices, Castle Street
Thornbury
South Gloucestershire
BS35 9BP
Phone: 01454 863649
fax: 01454 864473
I thought the workshop in Birmingham was very successful. I'd be
interested to know what you were hoping to get out of the event?
There was plenty of references to the variety of tools at our disposal
for public engagement from tea and cake to facebook.
At no time will social media replace the need for face to face
discussions, nor was this proposed at the event.
The point of the workshop was to cover some other options that people
might not have thought about and in this regard some points were quite
important I think given the economy, localism etc.
1 If we want to continue in our role as custodians of the historic
environment and to contribute to the creation of better quality places
we need new approaches that help us truly deliver more with less.
2 The fact that there are 30 million UK users of Facebook and 26
million UK users of Twitter means that we would be fools not to use
these as one of our communication channels.
3 Leaflets on doormats on my street are only relevant to the residents
of my street. However, if that message is also published on social media
the information or the approach has the potential to generate wider
interest. It doesn't mean it will happen, but to ignore the potential
would be a missed opportunity. I am more likely to read and respond to a
blog entry than a published case study.
4 If we as historic environment professionals are to remain relevant we
need to form new partnerships and collaborations. Use of social media
will enable this to happen. Although Know Your Place is not truly social
media, it is crowd sourced HER data. Since launching the site last year
our HER has not only reached a wider audience, but we now have
partnership projects with the Universities (Bristol and UWE neither of
which ever used to speak to me), I have given talks to umpteen
organisations such as our local Civic Society, we have had three
exhibitions and the website is mentioned by developers, planners and
most importantly local members. I would argue that the use of social
media might actually result in more face to face discussions.
One comment in my group at the workshop was that just to get heritage
on the table when it comes to regeneration, policy or place making would
be a result. Given the profile that the Bristol HER now has, might it
not be possible to achieve the same across the UK through the use of
social media? Discuss.
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