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Subject:

Re: MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH Digest - 30 Jun 2018 to 1 Jul 2018 (#2018-122)

From:

"Susan Crowther (snm)" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research." <[log in to unmask]>, Susan Crowther (snm)

Date:

Mon, 2 Jul 2018 09:19:38 +0000

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Hello Jane and Co, 
 
What an interesting request on a Monday morning. Unpacking phenotypes is not my strong point!! but thank you for the opportunity to enter the dialogue on this. 
 
I agree with some others here that nature of disturbing care is crucial also regarding for example environment and HCPs. Not sure how to articulate that well. 
 
Also curious on how 'Healthy mother who feels joy and power', I agree yet how is that defined? 
Lastly the 37-42 weeks parameters seem rather incongruent as a physiologic birth can occur outside of these parameters surely? I have cared for many women who have by choice avoided IOL and had physiological births at 43 week. Some women have had physiological birth at 36 weeks. I wonder if the notion of physiologic birth is being conflated with what is now considered/accepted as normal birth in the list you have suggested? Just a thought. 
 
Cheers 
 
Susan 
Dr Susan Crowther, Professor of Midwifery 
Robert Gordon University | Garthdee Road|Aberdeen | AB10 7AQ 
T: +44(0)1224 263291    ORCID ID:  0000-0002-4133-2189 
Twitter: https://twitter.com/SusanCrowtherMW     Blog: DrSusanCrowther.com 
 
 
 
 
 
-----Original Message----- 
From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH automatic digest system 
Sent: 02 July 2018 00:00 
To: [log in to unmask] 
Subject: MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH Digest - 30 Jun 2018 to 1 Jul 2018 (#2018-122) 
 
There are 11 messages totaling 2408 lines in this issue. 
 
Topics of the day: 
 
  1. Advice on physiologic birth (8) 
  2. AW: Advice on physiologic birth (2) 
  3. Dear Canadians on the list 
 
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Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 13:01:52 +0000 
From:    "Sandall, Jane" <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Please see post from hannah Dahlen 
All replies to list please. 
 
Hi Brains Trust. 
 
I have a question for you. A few of us such as Holly Powell Kennedy, Soo Downe and Maralyn Foureur, Jane Sandall and I are trying to develop a phenotype of physiological birth (or undisturbed birth). 
 
This is based on the thrifty phenotype hypothesis (Barres & Zierath, 2016) where critical windows of development both in utero and childhood are associated with development of disease later in life. 
 
The EPIIC hypothesis https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23414680 we published in 2013 posits that eustress (normal physiological stress) during the window of the actual labor and birth is protective by assuring that the hormonal physiology is supported and undisturbed (Dahlen et al, 2013). 
 
Below is a list we have come up with and we want to have it concise but not forget anything major. Please let us know what you think and if we have forgotten something important: 
 
Characteristics of “undisturbed” birth 
• Spontaneous onset & progression of labor to vaginal birth at term [37-42 weeks] of a singleton infant in cephalic presentation • No pharmacologic intervention (including antibiotics) • Intermittent auscultation of the fetal heart • No treatment required for blood loss • Mother able to move about as desired • Mother able to eat and drink as desired • Mother able to be attended by companions of choice • Infant required no resuscitation • Skin-to-skin • Delayed cord clamping • Infant able to breastfeed within one hour of birth • Healthy mother who feels joy and power 
 
Thanks as always for sharing your wisdom! 
 
Jane Sandall CBE 
Professor of Women's Health 
King's College London 
[log in to unmask] 
07713 743150 
 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 13:08:42 +0000 
From:    "Adrian Smith [LIB]" <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Re: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
 
Some definition of phenotype may be helpful 
 
 
e.g. https://www.biology-online.org/dictionary/Phenotype 
 
 
Phenotype - Biology-Online Dictionary<https://www.biology-online.org/dictionary/Phenotype> 
www.biology-online.org 
phenotypic. adjective. Of, pertaining to, relating to, describing a phenotype. Supplement. The phenotype is the total characteristics displayed by an organism under a particular set of environmental factors, regardless of the actual genotype of the organism. 
 
 
 
 
________________________________ 
From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 18:16:22 +0000 
From:    Mechthild Gross <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: AW: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Dear Hanna and all, 
 
administering a peripheral venous line as a routine procedure may increase the likelihood to administer drugs during labour and birth. Maybe it would be good to avoid doing it. 
Good luck 
 
Mechthild 
 
Prof. Dr. Mechthild M. Gross, Hebamme 
Head of Midwifery Research and Education Unit Department of Obstetrics, Gynaecology & Reproductive Medicine Hannover Medical School Carl-Neuberg-Str. 1 D - 30625 Hannover 
Tel: ++49 511 532 6116, Fax: ++49 511 532 6191 
Mobil: ++49 176 1532 6116 
[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> 
www.mh-hannover.de/Hebammenwissenschaft.html<http://www.mh-hannover.de/Hebammenwissenschaft.html> 
 
 
 
 
Von: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Im Auftrag von Sandall, Jane 
Gesendet: Sonntag, 1. Juli 2018 15:02 
An: [log in to unmask] 
Betreff: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Please see post from hannah Dahlen 
All replies to list please. 
 
Hi Brains Trust. 
 
I have a question for you. A few of us such as Holly Powell Kennedy, Soo Downe and Maralyn Foureur, Jane Sandall and I are trying to develop a phenotype of physiological birth (or undisturbed birth). 
 
This is based on the thrifty phenotype hypothesis (Barres & Zierath, 2016) where critical windows of development both in utero and childhood are associated with development of disease later in life. 
 
The EPIIC hypothesis https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23414680 we published in 2013 posits that eustress (normal physiological stress) during the window of the actual labor and birth is protective by assuring that the hormonal physiology is supported and undisturbed (Dahlen et al, 2013). 
 
Below is a list we have come up with and we want to have it concise but not forget anything major. Please let us know what you think and if we have forgotten something important: 
 
Characteristics of "undisturbed" birth 
* Spontaneous onset & progression of labor to vaginal birth at term [37-42 weeks] of a singleton infant in cephalic presentation 
* No pharmacologic intervention (including antibiotics) 
* Intermittent auscultation of the fetal heart 
* No treatment required for blood loss 
* Mother able to move about as desired 
* Mother able to eat and drink as desired 
* Mother able to be attended by companions of choice 
* Infant required no resuscitation 
* Skin-to-skin 
* Delayed cord clamping 
* Infant able to breastfeed within one hour of birth 
* Healthy mother who feels joy and power 
 
Thanks as always for sharing your wisdom! 
 
Jane Sandall CBE 
Professor of Women's Health 
King's College London 
[log in to unmask] 
07713 743150 
 
________________________________ 
 
To unsubscribe from the MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH list, click the following link: 
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######################################################################## 
 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 18:10:43 +0000 
From:    Ellen Blix <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Dear Canadians on the list 
 
Does any of you have access to this article: Liston R, Sawchuck D, Young D. No. 197b-Fetal Health Surveillance: Intrapartum 
>Consensus Guideline. Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology Canada. >2018;40(4):e298-e322. 
 
And if you could send me a copy ([log in to unmask]) it would be really helpful. (I need it for a review of guidelines, our library does not have access to the journal and it takes weeks to get a paper copy.) 
 
Regards, Ellen 
 
Ellen Blix 
Professor, midwife 
Faculty of Health Sciences 
OsloMet - Oslo Metropolitan University 
Norway 
 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 18:34:34 +0000 
From:    Ellen Blix <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Re: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Dear Hannah and all 
Very good points - but what about undisturbed care of the woman? That the midwife/other carer is able to provide one-to-one care. 
Regards, Ellen 
 
Ellen Blix 
Professor, midwife 
Faculty of Health Sciences 
OsloMet - Oslo Metropolitan University 
Oslo, Norway 
 
From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 19:02:06 +0000 
From:    "Nieuwenhuijze M (AV-M)" <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Re: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Great list. 
Shouldn't there also be: 
 
*         spontaneous birth/expulsion of complete placenta (including membranes) 
 
Met vriendelijke groet | Kind regards, 
 
Marianne Nieuwenhuijze PhD MPH RM 
Lector Midwifery | Professor of Midwifery Lectoraat Midwifery Science | Research Centre for Midwifery Science Academie Verloskunde Maastricht Zuyd University 
+31(0)43 388 54 11 
[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>, 
www.av-m.nl<http://www.av-m.nl/> 
Postbus 1256, 6201 BG Maastricht, Universiteitssingel 60, 6229 ER Maastricht 
 
[ZUYD] 
 
 
 
 
 
From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Sandall, Jane 
Sent: zondag 1 juli 2018 15:02 
To: [log in to unmask] 
Subject: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Please see post from hannah Dahlen 
All replies to list please. 
 
Hi Brains Trust. 
 
I have a question for you. A few of us such as Holly Powell Kennedy, Soo Downe and Maralyn Foureur, Jane Sandall and I are trying to develop a phenotype of physiological birth (or undisturbed birth). 
 
This is based on the thrifty phenotype hypothesis (Barres & Zierath, 2016) where critical windows of development both in utero and childhood are associated with development of disease later in life. 
 
The EPIIC hypothesis https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23414680 we published in 2013 posits that eustress (normal physiological stress) during the window of the actual labor and birth is protective by assuring that the hormonal physiology is supported and undisturbed (Dahlen et al, 2013). 
 
Below is a list we have come up with and we want to have it concise but not forget anything major. Please let us know what you think and if we have forgotten something important: 
 
Characteristics of "undisturbed" birth 
* Spontaneous onset & progression of labor to vaginal birth at term [37-42 weeks] of a singleton infant in cephalic presentation 
* No pharmacologic intervention (including antibiotics) 
* Intermittent auscultation of the fetal heart 
* No treatment required for blood loss 
* Mother able to move about as desired 
* Mother able to eat and drink as desired 
* Mother able to be attended by companions of choice 
* Infant required no resuscitation 
* Skin-to-skin 
* Delayed cord clamping 
* Infant able to breastfeed within one hour of birth 
* Healthy mother who feels joy and power 
 
Thanks as always for sharing your wisdom! 
 
Jane Sandall CBE 
Professor of Women's Health 
King's College London 
[log in to unmask] 
07713 743150 
 
________________________________ 
 
To unsubscribe from the MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH list, click the following link: 
https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?SUBED1=MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH&A=1 
 
######################################################################## 
 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 19:40:45 +0000 
From:    "Prins, Marianne" <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Re: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Dear Hannah and Jane, 
 
Probably a good idea to include: 
 
-        Spontaneous rupture of membranes 
 
-        We have to think on the number of vaginal examinations in the active phase 
 
-        Labour without episiotomy? 
 
-        Mother and child undisturbed contact first two hours post partum? 
 
Best whishes Marianne Prins 
 
From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 21:47:09 +0200 
From:    Suze Jans <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Re: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
 
Great list! 
 
I would add: 
 
Mother able to choose the position she wants during 2nd and 3rd stage. 
 
Best wishes 
 
Suze 
 
Suze Jans, PhD, MSc. RM 
TNO 
Leiden 
 
> On 1 Jul 2018, at 21:02, Nieuwenhuijze M (AV-M) <[log in to unmask]> wrote: 
> 
> Great list. 
> Shouldn’t there also be: 
> ·         spontaneous birth/expulsion of complete placenta (including membranes) 
> 
> Met vriendelijke groet | Kind regards, 
> 
> Marianne Nieuwenhuijze PhD MPH RM 
> 
> Lector Midwifery | Professor of Midwifery Lectoraat Midwifery Science 
> | Research Centre for Midwifery Science Academie Verloskunde 
> Maastricht Zuyd University 
> +31(0)43 388 54 11 
> [log in to unmask], 
> www.av-m.nl 
> Postbus 1256, 6201 BG Maastricht, Universiteitssingel 60, 6229 ER 
> Maastricht <image001.gif> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health 
> research. [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of 
> Sandall, Jane 
> Sent: zondag 1 juli 2018 15:02 
> To: [log in to unmask] 
> Subject: Advice on physiologic birth 
> 
> Please see post from hannah Dahlen 
> All replies to list please. 
> 
> Hi Brains Trust. 
> 
> I have a question for you. A few of us such as Holly Powell Kennedy, Soo Downe and Maralyn Foureur, Jane Sandall and I are trying to develop a phenotype of physiological birth (or undisturbed birth). 
> 
> This is based on the thrifty phenotype hypothesis (Barres & Zierath, 2016) where critical windows of development both in utero and childhood are associated with development of disease later in life. 
> 
> The EPIIC hypothesis https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23414680 we published in 2013 posits that eustress (normal physiological stress) during the window of the actual labor and birth is protective by assuring that the hormonal physiology is supported and undisturbed (Dahlen et al, 2013). 
> 
> Below is a list we have come up with and we want to have it concise but not forget anything major. Please let us know what you think and if we have forgotten something important: 
> 
> Characteristics of “undisturbed” birth • Spontaneous onset & 
> progression of labor to vaginal birth at term [37-42 weeks] of a 
> singleton infant in cephalic presentation • No pharmacologic 
> intervention (including antibiotics) • Intermittent auscultation of 
> the fetal heart • No treatment required for blood loss • Mother able 
> to move about as desired • Mother able to eat and drink as desired • 
> Mother able to be attended by companions of choice • Infant required 
> no resuscitation • Skin-to-skin • Delayed cord clamping • Infant able 
> to breastfeed within one hour of birth • Healthy mother who feels joy 
> and power 
> 
> Thanks as always for sharing your wisdom! 
> 
> Jane Sandall CBE 
> Professor of Women's Health 
> King's College London 
> [log in to unmask] 
> 07713 743150 
> 
> To unsubscribe from the MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH list, click the following link: 
> https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?SUBED1=MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH& 
> A=1 
> 
> 
> To unsubscribe from the MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH list, click the following link: 
> https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?SUBED1=MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH& 
> A=1 
 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 21:04:53 +0000 
From:    Jenny Hall <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Re: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
?This is wonderful! 
 
'Undisturbed' to me also means that the caregivers are experienced and 'sit on their hands', 'watchful waiting' and create and protect a safe space 
 
 
Best Wishes 
Jenny 
 
Dr Jenny Hall, Fellow RCM, Senior Fellow HEA Senior Lecturer, PGCert Education practice Centre for Excellence in learning, Bournemouth University, Executive Business Centre, 
 
________________________________ 
From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Sun, 1 Jul 2018 21:55:24 +0000 
From:    reem hatamleh <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Re: AW: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Dear allI think there are two points can be added to the definition 1. no need for episiotomy2. no incidence of laceration or tear in the birth canal 
 
Dr. Reem Hatamleh, PhD, RN, RMW assistant professor in Midwifery Maternal and Child Health and Midwifery Department Jordan university of Science and Technology/ Faculty of Nursing mail address: P.O Box 3030 Irbid 22110, Jordan phone: 0096227201000 Ext, 23712 e.mail: [log in to unmask] [log in to unmask] 
 
    On ‎Sunday‎, ‎July‎ ‎1‎, ‎2018‎ ‎09‎:‎16‎:‎33‎ ‎PM‎ ‎EEST, Mechthild Gross <[log in to unmask]> wrote: 
 
 #yiv5343583346 #yiv5343583346 -- _filtered #yiv5343583346 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv5343583346 {font-family:Tahoma;panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}#yiv5343583346 #yiv5343583346 p.yiv5343583346MsoNormal, #yiv5343583346 li.yiv5343583346MsoNormal, #yiv5343583346 div.yiv5343583346MsoNormal {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:New;}#yiv5343583346 a:link, #yiv5343583346 span.yiv5343583346MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv5343583346 a:visited, #yiv5343583346 span.yiv5343583346MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv5343583346 p {margin-right:0cm;margin-left:0cm;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:New;}#yiv5343583346 span.yiv5343583346E-MailFormatvorlage18 {color:#1F497D;}#yiv5343583346 .yiv5343583346MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;} _filtered #yiv5343583346 {margin:70.85pt 70.85pt 2.0cm 70.85pt;}#yiv5343583346 div.yiv5343583346WordSection1 {}#yiv5343583346 Dear Hanna and all, 
 
 
 
administering a peripheral venous line as a routine procedure may increase the likelihood to administer drugs during labour and birth. Maybe it would be good to avoid doing it. 
 
Good luck 
 
 
 
Mechthild 
 
 
 
Prof. Dr. Mechthild M. Gross, Hebamme 
 
Head of Midwifery Research and Education Unit 
 
Department of Obstetrics, Gynaecology & Reproductive Medicine 
 
Hannover Medical School 
 
Carl-Neuberg-Str. 1 
 
D – 30625 Hannover 
 
Tel: ++49 511 532 6116, Fax: ++49 511 532 6191 
 
Mobil: ++49 176 1532 6116 
 
[log in to unmask] 
 
www.mh-hannover.de/Hebammenwissenschaft.html 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Von: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research.[mailto:[log in to unmask]]Im Auftrag von Sandall, Jane 
Gesendet: Sonntag, 1. Juli 2018 15:02 
An: [log in to unmask] 
Betreff: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
 
 
Please see post from hannah Dahlen 
 
All replies to list please. 
 
 
 
Hi Brains Trust. 
 
 
 
I have a question for you. A few of us such as Holly Powell Kennedy, Soo Downe and Maralyn Foureur, Jane Sandall and I are trying to develop a phenotype of physiological birth (or undisturbed birth). 
 
 
 
This is based on the thrifty phenotype hypothesis (Barres & Zierath, 2016) where critical windows of development both in utero and childhood are associated with development of disease later in life. 
 
 
 
The EPIIC hypothesis https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23414680 we published in 2013 posits that eustress (normal physiological stress) during the window of the actual labor and birth is protective by assuring that the hormonal physiology is supported and undisturbed (Dahlen et al, 2013). 
 
 
 
Below is a list we have come up with and we want to have it concise but not forget anything major. Please let us know what you think and if we have forgotten something important: 
 
 
 
Characteristics of “undisturbed” birth 
 
• Spontaneous onset & progression of labor to vaginal birth at term [37-42 weeks] of a singleton infant in cephalic presentation 
 
• No pharmacologic intervention (including antibiotics) 
 
• Intermittent auscultation of the fetal heart 
 
• No treatment required for blood loss 
 
• Mother able to move about as desired 
 
• Mother able to eat and drink as desired 
 
• Mother able to be attended by companions of choice 
 
• Infant required no resuscitation 
 
• Skin-to-skin 
 
• Delayed cord clamping 
 
• Infant able to breastfeed within one hour of birth 
 
• Healthy mother who feels joy and power 
 
 
 
Thanks as always for sharing your wisdom! 
 
 
 
Jane Sandall CBE 
 
Professor of Women's Health 
 
King's College London 
 
[log in to unmask] 
 
07713 743150 
 
 
 
To unsubscribe from the MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH list, click the following link: 
https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?SUBED1=MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH&A=1 
 
 
To unsubscribe from the MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH list, click the following link: 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date:    Mon, 2 Jul 2018 09:55:16 +1200 
From:    Ruth Martis <[log in to unmask]> 
Subject: Re: Advice on physiologic birth 
 
Routine episiotomy free, enema free, shaving free births as it is still practice in a number of countries 
 
 
 
From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. 
 
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------------------------------ 
 
End of MIDWIFERY-RESEARCH Digest - 30 Jun 2018 to 1 Jul 2018 (#2018-122) 
************************************************************************ 
 
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