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In message Tue, 21 Jan 1997 12:33:27 -1000, Karen Jolly <[log in to unmask]> writes: However, my understanding was that > voluntary castration was forbidden by the church, and castrated men were > restricted from clerical positions (as was a concern with Abelard). > (Reasons? One should control lust through an act of the will, resisting > temptation? Or notions of the "whole man"?) You are quite right. Both notions count; from a legal point of view maybe especially the second one. There exists a papal dispensation from the 1450's (sorry, no reference at hand) for a German monk who had cut off his genitals in his cell `haunted by lust' or some similar phrase. A bit drastic, I guess. Bram van den Hoven van Genderen, Utrecht university %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%