Caro Giulio,

Excuse me for the way I wrote that statement, which may seem to indicate a general behaviour. Some lists of expert panels for the EC funding programmes are accessible from the web. For example:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=2ahUKEwjvvbnSwZrfAhVpRBUIHWnMCFIQFjAAegQIABAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fec.europa.eu%2Fresearch%2Fparticipants%2Fdata%2Fref%2Ffp7%2Flist_fp7_experts%2Fpeople%2Fmc_actions%2Fpeople_2013_en.xlsx&usg=AOvVaw1dKryPRubHRVsCmSRQVVAT

The document has been downloaded from the page:

https://ec.europa.eu/info/funding-tenders/opportunities/portal/screen/how-to-participate/reference-documents

were it is accessible at “List of FP7 expert evaluators” / “People” / “Marie-Curie Actions” / “Expert list PEOPLE 2013”

So this is only one list, for one year and for one specific programme. It is the only list I’ve opened from the Portal. One of the first experts comes from a consultancy that, among many other activities: (copied from their webpage) “We can write your funding application and help you manage the entire administration of your project. Or we can support and optimise parts of the funding application process.”

Well, it may be the only case among thousands of experts. In that case, I’ve been lucky to only spend 15 minutes on the search.

Best,

Dear Javier,

you wrote:

"What it’s worse in my opinion: you actually find that some of these professionals of grant-writing are already part of the expert panels that will evaluate the grant proposals. This happens at least in the European Commission programmes"

Would you be so kind to  specify:

1) to which European Commission programmes are you referring to and,

2) who are these grant-writing professionals that are also part of the evaluating expert panels.

Otherwise your statement is a generic "false accuse".

Best regards,

Giulio Di Toro

***********

Dear all,

 

Nobody knows by birth how to write a successful proposal. And we all have learnt how to write science (and proposals) through practice, improving from our failures and with the help of more experienced people; and a forum like this should offer that assistance, like many of you have already done. But it is our duty and our success to write the proposal by ourselves. If we hire mercenaries to do our job, next step will be to hire them to defend our PhD dissertation. And I think that this was Alan’s point.  …These “professionals” are becoming as indispensable as lawyers in court!

 

What it’s worse in my opinion: you actually find that some of these professionals of grant-writing are already part of the expert panels that will evaluate the grant proposals. This happens at least in the European Commission programmes. …Have you ever seen a judge hiring himself as an attorney at his own court?? That wouldn’t be fair, wouldn’t it?

 

Best wishes,

 

Javier Rodríguez Aller, PhD.

Servicio de Geocronología y Geoquímica Isotópica

SGIker- Facultad de Ciencia y Tecnología

Universidad del País Vasco

Barrio Sarriena s/n

E48940 Leioa

SPAIN

 

[log in to unmask]

http://www.ehu.eus/en/web/sgiker/geokronologia-eta-geokimika-isotopikoa-aurkezpena

http://www.linkedin.com/in/javi-rodriguez-032a5360

 

 

De: Tectonics & structural geology discussion list <[log in to unmask]> En nombre de Douwe van Hinsbergen
Enviado el: 11 December 2018 18:44
Para: [log in to unmask]
Asunto: Re: Grant Writer

 

Hi Carl,

 

Can you specify what kind of grant you’re aiming for? What’s the budget, time, and personnel you’re thinking of? Then we could provide you with examples of past successful proposals.

 

Cheers,

Douwe

Sent from my iPhone

On 11 Dec 2018, at 18:24, Allaz Julien <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Dear Carl (and other list reader),

 

I can only second Aaron’s comment; one purpose of this email list is indeed to provide help and guidance, not to insult them… A while ago, I had also issues similar to this one, as I had never written a grant and I needed some strong help to start somewhere. Fortunately I was in the academics and my colleagues (which became my grant collaborators) helped me quite a lot.

 

There is an excellent book that helped me a lot in avoiding common errors: http://www.grantcentral.com/workbooks/national-institutes-of-health/ Even if it comes from NIH and is not geology oriented, it presents some broad guidelines for writing a grant. There are other books you can find only that will give some guidelines.

 

It helps a lot to read other’s proposal and/or to go and chat with people in your field that have written similar grant - if you can find someone that had written a successful grant to share it with you, this could help. Actually, it could help the group if you describe very briefly the main line of the research to be enabled - a grant for stuctural geology oriented work may not be written the same as a grant for some ore geology or seismological survey, although the broad line will remain the same: first introduce the subject with the key question to be answer, a statement of what is known, and then diving into what you will do, how you will do it, and what are the expected outcome / how this approach will be able to answer the question... There is no ultimate guide to write a grant, as it chiefly depends on the goal(s) of your research, and what you are asking for.

 

One thing that is absolutely mandatory: carefully reading the guideline of the funding agency - every year, many grants don’t even go into review for stupid administrative mistake / missing document or so, and this is valid for whichever funding agency you are applying for (thanks to the bureaucracy…).

 

And aim for absolute excellence and perfection, not just for good… Nowadays, a “good review” is often not good enough (sadly). And don’t get disappointed if the first (or the second) attempt is a fail, this is “common” unless you are an exceptional writer and/or if you grant proposal is very attractive, perseverance is key (and also a careful reading of the reviews and the comments received after a denial :). I don’t know about Canada, but in the US and in Europe a grant can get some plus if there is a strong broader impact with teaching / mentoring and societal implications.

 

Good luck in your grant writing or finding someone to help you!

 

Julien

 

 

###########################

Dr. Julien Allaz
Head assistant for SEM/EPMA

Inst. für Geochemie und Petrologie

ETH Zürich
NW E 84
Clausiusstrasse 25
8092 Zürich
Switzerland

 

Tel: +41 44 632 37 20

Fax: +41 44 632 16 36

Email: [log in to unmask]

###########################

On 11 Dec 2018, at 18:01, Yoshinobu, Aaron <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

 

Alan Gibbs,

 

This person was asking for “help”, guidance, mentorship, etc., never having written a proposal before. IN fact, this request is coming from a non-academic, consulting geologist such that he probably doesn’t have access to the various state-funded workshops on grant writing that universities provide. His email hardly equates to plagiarism or the other nefarious things you mentioned.

 

Aaron Yoshinobu

 

Prof. Aaron S. Yoshinobu

Department of Geosciences

Texas Tech University

Lubbock, TX 79409-1053

U.S.A.

 

 

 

 

 

From: Tectonics & structural geology discussion list <[log in to unmask]> on behalf of Alan Gibbs <[log in to unmask]>
Reply-To: Tectonics & structural geology discussion list <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 10:53 AM
To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Grant Writer

 

Write your own proposals. This is on a par with students employing an essay writing service. 

 

As an ex academic who wrote proposals, as an industrial co sponsor, as one who has at various times applied for industrial, central government grant funding and especially as a taxpayer I am totally horrified. I presume the same guys will write your papers and go for job interviews. 

 

Grow up. Write your own stuff. Learn to write your own proposals or you devalue the whole process. 

Alan Gibbs 

 

On 11 Dec 2018, at 10:49, deanne vanrooyen <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi Carl

I can recommend Kevin Driscoll (k‎[log in to unmask]), he has a lot of varied experience from being a grant writer at the University of Saskatchewan for years. He offers a very professional service, many of my colleagues have used it and are happy. His website  ‎is grantsdonewrite.ca

Deanne 

 

 

 

From: Carl Little Sent: Monday, 10 December 2018 11:11 PM To: [log in to unmask] Reply To: Tectonics & structural geology discussion list Subject: Grant Writer

‎

Dear list,

My boss just asked me to write a grant proposal but I have never written one before.  She suggested I try to find a professionl grant writer to help me.  Can anyone recommend a professional with experience in geosci grant writing?  Thanks,

 

Carl Little
Consulting Geologist
Toronto, ON, Canada

‎

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------------------------------------------------------------------------

Have a look at seismic faults in the lab.... plenty of friction melts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTfwJ3Elw5s

.... or abrupt accelerations and instantaneous melting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-N38H5aicM&feature=related

*************************************************************************

Giulio Di Toro

Full Professor in Structural Geology

c/o Università degli Studi di Padova

Dipartimento di Geoscienze

via Giovanni Gradenigo, 6

35131 Padova

ITALY

tel ++39 049 8279105

fax ++39 049 8279134

e-mail: [log in to unmask]

*************************************************************************

“Go my sons, buy stout shoes, climb the mountains, search the valleys,

the deserts, the sea shores, and the deep recess of the earth. Look for

the various kinds of minerals, note their characters and mark their origin.

Lastly, buy coal, build furnaces, observe and experiment without

ceasing, for in this way and in no other will you arrive at knowledge

of the nature and properties of things”.

Petrus Severinus (Peder Soerensen) naturalist, philosopher and physician (1542-1602)

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