It depends on who is doing the talking David. While I suppose I am one side of a certain line the term covers such a wide variety of different poetic practises these days that the only real pointer it gives is to a kind of community of names, not tribal exactly but similar. As I've said here before I don't particularly mind what my stuff gets called but I am interested when people try to eek out particulars. In some respects I don't think some of my work is any closer to the avant than a poet such as Peter Riley, but it depends on what work we are referring to. Peter Riley says he is not an avant-garde poet and I suppose he is right, but the 'community of names' he is associated with, and who tend to be the ones who appreciate his work most, definitely include many who get so labelled etc.

Cheers

Tim

On 4 Jan 2018, at 16:31, David Lace wrote:

Tim is an avantgarde poet and he too is critical of the situation