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Oh I mean no real equivalence was intended. I ought not go on, but I have doubts about both (WCW and that poem), which I don't mean to their detriment. Apologies, Luke On Sun, Sep 17, 2017 at 4:46 PM, Luke <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Hey Jamie, > > Oh OK, I was being overly rhetorical. Just suggesting that WCW's poetry *tends > *to be no worse. I didn't mean to be overly clever, anyway, just stating > my facile opinion. > > Cheers, > Luke > > On Sun, Sep 17, 2017 at 4:29 PM, Jamie McKendrick < > [log in to unmask]> wrote: > >> Sorry, Luke, I’ve no idea what you’re saying here. That poems like >> Larkin’s ‘Aubade’ are ‘ten a penny’? If only. >> And ‘Ever read Williams?’ means what? I have read all 3 Williamses (WCW, >> CKW, and HW) but am not sure of the Larkin connection if you mean the first >> or the second. >> Just asking. >> Best, >> Jamie >> >> *From:* Luke <[log in to unmask]> >> *Sent:* Saturday, September 16, 2017 8:52 PM >> *To:* [log in to unmask] >> *Subject:* Re: Philip Larkin any comments? >> >> If i wanted to be skeptical, I'd only say that >> >> > a powerful and exceptional poem. >> >> ten a penny'. Ever read Williams? Yes. But I share in your sympathies >> with Heaney, I think. Not able to express that, at all. >> >> Apologies, >> Luke >> >> >> On Sat, Sep 16, 2017 at 8:47 PM, Jamie McKendrick < >> [log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >>> I don’t think this is offered as an overarching definition of prose >>> narrative, Luke, in which little interest is shown. It’s Tim signalling, in >>> list code, a few indicators of baleful mainstream practice. >>> >>> A slightly longer quote could help: >>> >>> “...a type of poetry where the 'opinion' becomes expressed not as an >>> 'opinion', but as a 'message' wrapped up in a quasi narrative or anecdote, >>> framed as an example of an assumed collective 'it's obvious because it >>> makes sense and this is the sense it makes, as demonstrated by this >>> language/prosody' kind of thing...” >>> >>> I wonder if this description might work reasonably well to describe >>> Eliot’s lines, such as >>> >>> On the Rialto once. >>> The rats are underneath the piles. >>> The jew is underneath the lot. >>> >>> in ‘Burbank with a Baedeker: Bleistein with a Cigar’, or earlier from >>> the same poem: >>> >>> But this or such was Bleistein’s way: >>> A saggy bending of the knees >>> And elbows, with the palms turned out, >>> Chicago Semite Viennese. >>> >>> By contrast we really only learnt of Larkin’s prejudices, interest in >>> porn etc. not from his poems but his letters. >>> Out of his morose, heavy drinking, increasingly right-wing and >>> prejudiced later period hardly any poetry remains with the exception of >>> ‘Aubade’ which I differ from Heaney in considering a powerful and >>> exceptional poem. >>> Best, >>> Jamie >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Best, >>> Jamie >>> >>> *From:* Luke <[log in to unmask]> >>> *Sent:* Saturday, September 16, 2017 6:42 PM >>> *To:* [log in to unmask] >>> *Subject:* Re: Philip Larkin any comments? >>> >>> > a 'message' wrapped up in a quasi narrative or anecdote, framed as an >>> example of an assumed collective 'it's obvious because it makes sense and >>> this is the sense it makes, as demonstrated by this language/prosody' >>> >>> that is an interesting post, thanks. and that's "prose narrative"? >>> amazing. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Luke >>> >>> >> >> > >