 |
 |
I'm not a translator myself so am only guessing that there can be such a thing as a "bad" translation, in the sense of one that does not do the original poem justice. It would be an interesting new discussion to see if translations of a poem are the same poem as the original, if not then when we read a translation of a poem we must be reading a "new" poem. ---------Original Message---------- Kent Johnson wrote: OK, David. Though I don't see what "bad translations" have to do with it. What is a "bad" translation, anyway? There are bad (if by bad you mean not literal) translations that are great poems in their own right, after all. Pound's bad translations of Chinese poetry changed the course of English-language poetry, in fact. You wouldn't have Dylan without them, even, arguably. ---------Original Message---------- David Lace wrote: I’m responding to the idea that a lyric can’t be as good as page poetry, because a lyric needs a voice and music for it to have an effect, and without them something is lost. I’m saying that likewise a bad translation of a poem is also no good as something also can be lost. In other words, both page poems and lyrics are dependent on other elements to make them work. But as I said, for me those other elements are not essential as long as the imagery of a poem/song are not lost. -------------------Original Message-------------- Kent Johnson wrote: For example, I can't make heads or tails out of this. What basic positions are these comments linked to? ------------------Original Message--------------- David Lace wrote: That is true of some of his songs as seen on the page, but that could also be said of bad translations of page poetry. For me it's the imagery and emotions poems evoke more than how they "sound" via poetic metrics etc. -----------------Original Message---------------- Jamie McKendrick wrote: (In the case of Dylan, some great phrases and lines, but I'm still of the view that, for the most part, shorn of his extraordinary voice and the accompaniment, they mostly read as bad poetry.)