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medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture In general on labyrinths, Hermann Kern, Through the Labyrinth: Design and Meanings over 5000 Years (New York, 2000) is quite reliable, and there is a good recent article on that of Chartres by Gilles Fresson, "Le labyrinthe devoile?," in Michel Pansard, ed., Chartres: La grace d'une cathedrale (Strasbourg, 2013), pp. 293-97 Cheers, Jim ________________________________ From: medieval-religion - Scholarly discussions of medieval religious culture [[log in to unmask]] on behalf of Richard Legault [[log in to unmask]] Sent: January 29, 2016 2:24 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [M-R] Chartres Labyrinth medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture Mea culpa. I apologize again. I also accept we exasperating neophytes need to have our noses rubbed in it now and then. The investigative procedure in question was my own woefully slothful, incomplete and erroneous internet search of some of the texts, evidently not the right ones. John you provide exactly the level of detail I was looking for. Thank you for the information. Know that while I shall make every effort in the future to never again interrupt your breathing, I cannot guarantee I will succeed. I still have too much to learn. Richard J Legault On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 2:22 PM, John Dillon <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote: medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture 1) It would be interesting to know what set of facts or investigative procedures authorizes the breathtaking assertion "the word ‘Labyrinth’ is nowhere to be found in the Latin of Virgil’s Aeneid." That word occurs routinely not only in editions of the _Aeneid_ at 5. 588, the opening line of a simile based upon the Cretan Labyrinth: ut quondam Creta fertur Labyrinthus in alta parietibus textum caecis iter ancipitemque mille viis habuisse dolum, qua signa sequendi frangeret indeprensus et inremeabilis error: haud aliter... but also in the manuscript witnesses on which these editions are based as well as in the late antique commentary of Servius on the passage in question: Labyrinthus locus apud Cretam factus a Daedalo perplexis parietibus ubi Minotaurus inclusus est... So, if _Labyrinthus_ isn't in Vergil's Latin it was certainly in the text of the _Aeneid_ both anciently and medievally. And whereas the the poem as we have it does include verses that modern scholars have thought post-Vergilian, 5. 588 is not among them. The aforementioned assertion is therefore a great novelty. One looks forward to seeing it argued properly. 2) In classical Greek, ëáâýñéíèïò is said (so my Liddell-Scott-Jones, which itself is now getting slightly ancient) to be first attested at Herodotus, 2. 148. In classical Latin the adjective _labyrintheus_ first appears at Catullus, 64. 114 and the noun _labyrinthum_ (a neuter-gender by-form of masculine-gender _labyrinthus_) is used by Varro as quoted by Pliny, _N.H._ 36. 91. Both of those -- assuming Pliny's quotation to be accurate in this respect -- are from the first century BCE. _Labyrinthus_ itself first appears at Pomponius Mela, 1. 56 (earlier first century CE). Best, John Dillon ________________________________ From: medieval-religion - Scholarly discussions of medieval religious culture <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> on behalf of Richard Legault <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> Sent: Friday, January 29, 2016 7:47 AM To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: [M-R] Chartres Labyrinth medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture I’m reading up on the Chartres Labyrinth and its reputed association with pagan mythology. Heaven knows there was enough material in circulation and widely read c. 1200 CE for the designers to have known the stories as told by Virgil and Ovid for example. However after a bit of reading-upping, I’m surprised to find that the word ‘Labyrinth’ is nowhere to be found in the Latin of Virgil’s Aeneid nor in Ovid’s Metamorphoses. The Iliad in Homer’s Greek does not use it (ëáâýñéíèïò) either. All three tell or allude to some construction built by Daedalus and involve Ariadne, but do not name it. So my question to the Group is this: exactly where in the classical Latin or Greek texts does the word 'Labyrinth 'first appear? Richard J Legault <http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/medieval-religion> ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: subscribe medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> To leave the list, send the message: unsubscribe medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/medieval-religion ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: subscribe medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> To leave the list, send the message: unsubscribe medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/medieval-religion ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: subscribe medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: unsubscribe medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask] For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/medieval-religion