You say, "The list in my own humble view operates best when discussions are in progress which are critical in a rapid change era."

I couldn't agree more and said as much 2 days ago.

But then you say, "I am well aware many on the list prefer to just talk to their besties or publishers or employers..."

How do you know this? What evidence? I might surmise on why there is very little discussion here but I don't KNOW, how could I, how could you?

Then you say, "A lot also simply want to engage in nice mellow chat which excludes those who are newbies here."

What mellow chat? And what's wrong with mellow chat anyway. I don't join much mellow chat because there is very little of it to join and just because I prefer hot discussion it doesn't mean that that is the only purpose of the list. And what in heaven's name has it got to do with excluding newbies?

Then, "Poetry on these islands must advance towards totally new definitions of a kind people often quote or claim to observe."

I don't think that poetry has GOT TO do anything, but nevertheless what you say might be interesting if you could be a bit more specific.

Then, "I have learned that to succeed on these islands involves being ruthless."

Maybe so. Maybe only partly so, but either way what is the relevance? Please explain.

Then the worst part, "There are few on this list who observe basic decency or are prepared to declare their reasons for practicing monopolistic greed is good economics. To then claim to be Marxists or Feminists or against oppression makes me smile."

What the hell are you talking about? "Few on the list who observe basic decency" ??????? And I've never actually seen anyone here claim to be a Marxist, though some very well may be - (I'm a lapsed anarcho-syndicalist myself but along with most folk here I probably just tend to give the vague impression of a left leaning anti-establishment type). But yes, those 'feminists' have proclaimed themselves here as such on occasion, the she-devils. I don't relish such a discussion but if you want to challenge anyone on their sincerity or the width of their oppositional concern then do so. I too might like a serious discussion about the convenient compartmentalising or selective nature of issue-based oppositions but I would never presume to know what someone thinks until they say it, let alone accuse them.

These are weird and frightening and dismaying times Sean, I agree, but when haven't they been? I can only say to you what I've said before, stop conflating everything. Choose your target etc.

On 16 Mar 2015, at 19:26, Sean Carey wrote

But then you say

There are many many vehicles and platforms for promoting one's work Tim. Your interview opened up genuine issues in terms of the poet's role in 2015 via Fowler. The list in my own humble view operates best when discussions are in progress which are critical in a rapid change era. I am well aware many on the list prefer to just talk to their besties or publishers or employers but I reject that view.

A lot also simply want to engage in nice mellow chat which excludes those who are newbies here. Poetry on these islands must advance towards totally new definitions of a kind people often quote or claim to observe. I have learned that to succeed on these islands involves being ruthless. There are few on this list who observe basic decency or are prepared to declare their reasons for practicing monopolistic greed is good economics. To then claim to be Marxists or Feminists or against oppression makes me smile.

At a time when we dwell on two islands walking into macro civil war incited by fascists of all hues we are living in a world of total denial. The true role of anyone against civil strife is to fight it on all media platforms. I can assure anyone who sees this as doomsday thinking to engage the fascists in a textual way. In all my years in politics I have never seen such toxicity. Sadly being Irish is once again to be detested in language that I have never seen in my years in England. Yet the Irish left and supposed neo nationalists have failed to reject the UKIP Purpleshirts! Perhaps they are afraid to lose their Arts Council grants after May?

Also on many issue Irish populists share the UKIP agenda and a UKKIPPER may well appeal to them.