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Hi all I’m back in the office having been off since I posted that unpaid internship ad. I think I owe an apology for not reading/searching the group more before posting; it’s not my usual etiquette. But more importantly, I’m very interested to hear what you’ve had to say about the advert. I had limited the internship to two days per week because I know that most people, need to have paid work to manage. I thought this seemed a reasonable compromise, given that I can’t offer a paid internship (I don’t hold any budgets). I also thought/felt that this was morally acceptable given that it is for a charity, but I do take the points that have been made. Ade From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Michael Kenward Sent: 18 December 2014 15:57 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Volunteer internship in research communications Now now, Jo. I got shouted at for saying that. Those new to the long and contentious saga on unpaid internships might find it informative to dig back into the PSCI-COM archives for examples of people who see the point and offer paid internships. Here are a few from the past three or four months: #### Association of Medical Research Charities (AMRC) “full time, 35 hours a week, and we are paying the London living wage - £9.15 an hour.” #### Communications and Evaluation Internship Salary: £15,978 - £19,350 Contract Type: Fixed Term - 12 Month Contract Hours: Full Time Closing Date: 4 January 2015 NERC is offering a 12 month internship to help support the evaluation and monitoring of activities undertaken and dissemination of learning from this evaluation to mark NERC’s 50th anniversary during 2015. #### “News & Information Office of Oxford University is seeking a paid intern to support the work of media managers covering research stories in health, medicine, mathematics and the physical and life sciences” #### “List members may be interested in a paid internship opportunity for a Research Communications Officer at the medical research charity Ataxia UK.” #### The British Library, St Pancras, London Temporary Internship for 4 months Salary is – 8.80 per hour (London Living Wage) Full Time (36 hours per week over normal business hours) #### “List members may be interested in this one-year post for a communications intern at the Economic and Social Research Council (ESRC)” Carbon Brief (www.carbonbrief.org<http://www.carbonbrief.org>) Salary £22972 #### Research and graphics internship “Carbon Brief (www.carbonbrief.org<http://www.carbonbrief.org>) is looking for an intern to help us experiment with graphics, social media and other web-friendly ways to complement the news and analysis we publish.” “This is a six month internship paying the London living wage” #### With a history like that, from a range of diverse organisations, including several charities, is it any wonder that some of us get huffy when someone comes along seeking a free ride? Whether or not these all qualify as internships, or are really short-term contracts is not the point. Anyone posting “job opportunities” here that are unpaid can expect to be on the receiving end of less than welcoming comments from those of us who believe that this is a pernicious, and now possibly illegal, practice. These examples show what is possible. Oh, and congratulations and gratitude to these organisations. May their interns thrive. MK From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Joana Silva Sent: 17 December 2014 19:39 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Volunteer internship in research communications Hello Ben This was a great email! Thanks for being such an eloquent voice in this matter :) Jo *happy in full employment* On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 2:19 PM, Ben Johnson <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote: actually neil, i dont have your best interests at heartl; rather i am thinking of those who cannot afford the luxury of such career enhancing holidays. but that is just my opinion Ben Johnson Graphic Science Part of The Training Group - Supporting public engagement in the research community • +44 (0) 1275 47 44 44 È +44 (0) 7521 690 724<tel:%2B44%20%280%29%207521%20690%20724> [log in to unmask] • www.graphicscience.co.uk Disclaimer: The author of this email never meant a word of it. do you really need to print this email? From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>] On Behalf Of Neil Stoker Sent: 17 December 2014 14:10 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Volunteer internship in research communications There is a back story, but does 'some of us hoped' mean that this is list policy? My take on it is that there are two sides to this - I'm coming at it from the perspective of someone who is interested in getting experience, and that can be 'enough' payment for me (it's my choice!), I believe that the #1 way to improve job prospects is to get experience, and the subject line was really clear that it was unpaid, . I also appreciate that people who disapprove of unpaid internships have the best interests of interns at heart, but it is, in the end, their opinion. Neil On 17 December 2014 at 13:57, Ben Johnson <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote: Tom, there is a bit of a back story here and many of us had hoped that adverts like this would not appear on this list again. Have a quick rummage through the archives using "Intern" as a search term best ben Ben Johnson Graphic Science Part of The Training Group - Supporting public engagement in the research community • +44 (0) 1275 47 44 44 È +44 (0) 7521 690 724<tel:%2B44%20%280%29%207521%20690%20724> [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> • www.graphicscience.co.uk<http://www.graphicscience.co.uk> Disclaimer: The author of this email never meant a word of it. do you really need to print this email? From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>] On Behalf Of Tom Gibson Sent: 17 December 2014 13:19 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Volunteer internship in research communications Hi Michael, I don’t see what you’re getting at, and your ire seems ill-placed. The first word of the listing, and of the email subject, is ‘Volunteer’, so the question of payment is already dealt with. Tom On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 12:35 PM, Michael Kenward <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote: I see no mention of any payment on this website. Massive demand for “Key skills and qualities” and “Desired education and experience”. Minimal “How will you benefit?” Oh, it is a charity. That’s all right then. MK From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Ade Deane-Pratt Sent: 17 December 2014 11:40 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: [PSCI-COM] Volunteer internship in research communications Hello there, We have a volunteer internship role available, ideally for 2 days per week for 3 months, in central London. Closing date is noon on Monday 5 January. Details here: http://www.charityjob.co.uk/volunteer-jobs/volunteer-research-communications-intern/359947?tsId=8 Ade Deane-Pratt Research Communications Officer Fight for Sight T: 020 7264 3900 D: 020 7264 3906 ********************************************************************** ********************************************************************** Commands - send an email (any subject) to [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> with one of the following messages (ignoring text in brackets) • set psci-com nomail (to stop receiving messages while on holiday) • set psci-com mail (to resume getting messages) • signoff psci-com (to leave the list) • Subscribe here https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=psci-com Contact list owner at [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Small print and JISCMail acceptable use policy https://sites.google.com/site/pscicomjiscmail/the-small-print ********************************************************************** ********************************************************************** Commands - send an email (any subject) to [log in to unmask] with one of the following messages (ignoring text in brackets) • set psci-com nomail (to stop receiving messages while on holiday) • set psci-com mail (to resume getting messages) • signoff psci-com (to leave the list) • Subscribe here https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=psci-com Contact list owner at [log in to unmask] Small print and JISCMail acceptable use policy https://sites.google.com/site/pscicomjiscmail/the-small-print **********************************************************************