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I agree with Michael. Why not encourage these sorts of free blogs to actually give something back, whether it's valuable editor's advice, or your own copyright? I don't think this debate should be shouted down. Especially on arguments that people the people who don't want to work for free are lazy snobs. Frankly if money were involved, I bet these blog curators would have actual incentive to take on editing duties. Collaboration is a fine thing. These blogs can help link and showcase writers. But there can be a world of difference between writing science for fun and passion, and actually being a good science communicator. I did a lot of free writing while studying for an MSc in a sci-comm subject. I rarely received any feedback. So arguably I built up a portfolio- but only in professional, paid jobs did I receive valuable feedback, which massively improved my writing skills. What's the point in garnering credits off free blogs if your writing doesn't improve? Are we encouraging science communication to be a game of smoke and mirrors, talking ourselves up as great writers and communicators, bragging about credits and headlines, without being able to actually do the work? Besides, why not create your own website and share your articles from there? Creating my own website has given me the chance to learn a lot more about web design and social media. Each article takes a lot of time to write alongside my day job. I would not want to be criticised for not giving my writing away for free, to a stranger whose credentials I don't know. -------------- @scient_art www.scientart.com LinkedIn profile <https://www.linkedin.com/pub/annabel-slater/1b/708/532> The Talent Manager profile <https://www.thetalentmanager.co.uk/people/12756/annabel-slater> On Thu, Oct 16, 2014 at 10:44 PM, Michael Kenward <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > You have every reason to “snark” at a dinosaur’s observations from the > era of the manual typewriter. > > > > My point is that writing for free for any old website will teach you > nothing and may actually harm your career prospects. > > > > Slapping unedited twaddle on a website may convince potential employers > and customers that you are a hopeless case, when a little guidance would > help you to polish those gems-in-waiting and improve what comes later. > > > > By all means write for free for a site that offers some editorial rigour, > one that will tell you that you have written rubbish and that your story is > of no interest. That’s what a news editor does. > > > > A couple of people have suggested a collective attempt to create something > that does what Blu Dot is setting out to achieve. Wonderful idea. (Doesn’t > it exist already?) Especially if it has a (possibly closed) discussion area > where there could be constructive “literary criticism” of the sort that > helped to shape my writing. > > > > Maybe even Blu Dot could add this to what it does, and could sign up a few > experienced editors who would donate their time to the venture. > > > > Who could run such a website? Nature, the British Science Association? Any > other thoughts? > > > > So, don’t just grab at any opportunity going, create one that helps > aspiring writers rather than publishers with aspirations to untold ad > revenue. > > > > MK > > > > > > *From:* psci-com: on public engagement with science [ > mailto:[log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>] *On Behalf Of *james > riley > *Sent:* 2014-October-16 21:00 > *To:* [log in to unmask] > *Subject:* Re: [PSCI-COM] Blu Dot, a new science and technology blog, is > looking forwriters. > > > > MK, you say that: > > > > I got paid for my science writing from day one – I have since done too > much free writing than is good for me – but I had the benefit of working > with some seriously cynical old hacks who quickly knocked my writing into > shape. > > > > And: > > > > If Blu Dot is a bunch of aspiring writers and editors who have not been > through this process, then offering them free words will do not much to > hone writing skills. > > > > You are truly lucky to have been paid since day one. You are also lucky > that the job market had abundant opportunities for you as a journalistic > fledgling. I do not, however, think this matches the experience of most > people (or perhaps anybody) trying to break into science writing today. If > anyone has had this experience in the last few years, do speak up. I think > most people volunteer on student newspapers, elect to write their own > blogs, and yes, even stoop to the apparently shameful level of writing for > free on another person's website. I personally think this shows initiative > and a passion for writing, even if the execution is a little disheveled. > > > > Indeed the "cynical hacks" that you worked for must have helped you > become the writer you are today. If others could have the same > experience, they too could be moulded into better writers - perhaps, even, > dropping, the, occasional, unneeded, comma, or, dash. But to get access to > these gurus of the written word you need experience. To get a job at a > respectable publication, where the mot cynical and sadistic of hacks dwell, > you need to show you have been writing. And if you cannot get paid to > write "from day one" (which is highly unlikely these days), then you are > going to need to write for free to gain access to these "cynical old hacks" > who can truly transform your prose. It's a long-term development choice. > > > > I am sorry to snark. But it is slightly annoying when people who have jobs > in a particular field, which is getting harder and harder to > penetrate, belittle those who are willing to take unpaid opportunities to > give themselves a better chance of employment. If you don't want to work > for free - don't. However, as a method of expanding a portfolio, unpaid > work is one of the few options an aspiring science writer has. Although it > certainly shouldn't be something one does for a long time. > > > > The point you make about copyright is valid. If you are to work for free, > you should keep the intellectual property. > > > > JR > > > ------------------------------ > > *From:* psci-com: on public engagement with science < > [log in to unmask]> on behalf of Michael Kenward <[log in to unmask]> > *Sent:* Thursday, October 16, 2014 4:07 PM > *To:* [log in to unmask] > *Subject:* Re: [PSCI-COM] Blu Dot, a new science and technology blog, is > looking forwriters. > > > > Does Blu Dot have a team of experienced and capable editors? If not > aspiring writers who take up this invitation will learn little or nothing > of what it takes to “learn their chops”. > > > > I got paid for my science writing from day one – I have since done too > much free writing than is good for me – but I had the benefit of working > with some seriously cynical old hacks who quickly knocked my writing into > shape. Since then I have performed the same role for more people than I > care to (or can) remember. People still bear the scars of those editing > sessions, some writers even appreciated them. > > > > As an editor, I have worked on the basis that when someone write something > I can sit down and spend longer working through the copy with than they > spent writing it. The next time around it should be quicker process, both > in writing and editing. If we get to a third “training” session, then these > people probably should find work doing something more suited to their > skills. > > > > If Blu Dot is a bunch of aspiring writers and editors who have not been > through this process, then offering them free words will do not much to > hone writing skills. > > > > The “About” bit of the website tells me not much about this aspect. The > description of how they got their name is worryingly in need of an edit, > suggesting a lack of editing chops. Then there is the eccentric use of > punctuation, especially random dashes and commas, or is that a 20th > century, print-medium attitude? > > > > There are also disturbing points in the Submission guidelines. > > > > “We don’t have word limits or targets. We just want you to tell your > story.” > > > > In other words, we won’t edit. > > > > Finally there is the issue of copyright. The site does not mention this on > the page about submissions. It does though have its own page on the > subject. It says that “Our content is protected by copyright law.” Reading > on it assumes that Blu Dot owns that copyright. > > > > “The intellectual property rights of all content on this website, > including (but not limited to) text, pictures, design, logos, source code, > software and graphics belong to Blu Dot…” > > > > In other words, you write for free and hand over the copyright in the > process. A more equitable approach would be to leave the copyright with the > author. > > > > MK > > > > > > > > > > *From:* psci-com: on public engagement with science [ > mailto:[log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>] *On Behalf Of *Kat > Arney > *Sent:* 2014-October-15 23:37 > *To:* [log in to unmask] > *Subject:* Re: [PSCI-COM] Blu Dot, a new science and technology blog, is > looking forwriters. > > > > Ker-ching... or lack of, more like. > > However, it may be a nice opportunity for people starting out in science > comms to get something published, before everyone starts hammering it for > not paying. I did a hell of a lot of writing and radio for nothing when I > was starting out, but it helped me to learn my chops, find stories that > interested me, work to deadlines and build a portfolio when I had nothing > else to my name except a few unremarkable scientific papers. > > > > Kat > > > > Dr Kat Arney > > Science Communications Manager > > Cancer Research UK > > > > > ------------------------------ > > *From:* psci-com: on public engagement with science [ > [log in to unmask]] on behalf of Lee [[log in to unmask]] > *Sent:* 16 October 2014 00:22 > *To:* [log in to unmask] > *Subject:* Re: [PSCI-COM] Blu Dot, a new science and technology blog, is > looking forwriters. > > A voluntary role? > ------------------------------ > > *From: *Anna Samborska <[log in to unmask]> > *Sent: *15/10/2014 21:33 > *To: *[log in to unmask] > *Subject: *[PSCI-COM] Blu Dot, a new science and technology blog, is > looking forwriters. > > Dear PSCI-COM, > > > > I wanted to introduce Blu Dot – Science, Technology and Sustainable Design > blog. I am currently looking for contributors interested in having their > work published in an emerging and fast growing on-line publication. Please > see below for details and get in touch directly at [log in to unmask] > > > > I look forward to hearing from you. > > > > Kind regards, > > > > Anna Samborska > > > > *Founder* > > *Blu Dot* > > *www.bdot.co.uk* <http://UrlBlockedError.aspx> > > > > > > *SCIENCE WRITERS* > > > > *About us* > > Blu Dot is a blog with a difference. We publish meaningful content that is > equally relevant tomorrow as it is today. Our focus is on Science, > Technology and Design. > > Within these, we provide commentary on the latest news but also write > about past discoveries that shaped our understanding of the world. > > *About you* > Whether you want to write about the latest NASA space programme, history > of quantum physics or interview a wind turbine engineer, it sounds > excellent to us. > You enjoy working independently and produce high-quality content with > minimum guidance on the topic. You have an excellent command of English and > can explain complex subjects without using jargon. > > > *About the role*You will have full flexibility on your work location and > working times. You will be able to choose what type of articles you'd like > to write and in which subject. After all, we are after high-quality content > and believe this can only be achieved if you write about the topics you > enjoy most. > This is a voluntary role. To apply, please email a sample of your writing, > a brief description of your experience, interests and what topics you’d > like to cover to [log in to unmask] > > To get a feel for what the blog is about and what type of content we > publish visit www.bdot.co.uk <http://UrlBlockedError.aspx> > > ********************************************************************** > ********************************************************************** > > Commands - send an email (any subject) to [log in to unmask] with > one of the following messages (ignoring text in brackets) > > • set psci-com nomail (to stop receiving messages while on holiday) • set > psci-com mail (to resume getting messages) • signoff psci-com (to leave the > list) • Subscribe here > https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=psci-com > > Contact list owner at [log in to unmask] Small print and > JISCMail acceptable use policy > https://sites.google.com/site/pscicomjiscmail/the-small-print > > ********************************************************************** > ********************************************************************** Commands - send an email (any subject) to [log in to unmask] with one of the following messages (ignoring text in brackets) • set psci-com nomail (to stop receiving messages while on holiday) • set psci-com mail (to resume getting messages) • signoff psci-com (to leave the list) • Subscribe here https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=psci-com Contact list owner at [log in to unmask] Small print and JISCMail acceptable use policy https://sites.google.com/site/pscicomjiscmail/the-small-print **********************************************************************