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There are 17 messages totaling 3779 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. This List (7)
2. some new books (5)
3. Question (4)
4. Book launch: 'And After This I Saw : Selections from the work of Julian of
Norwich' by Edwin Kelly
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 12:00:51 +0900
From: jesse <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: This List
Discussion lists are tools. This one has certainly helped me in all kinds of ways. Sometimes one tool stays on the bench a bit longer than another, but that’s no reason to throw it away. The problem with Facebook is that you see too many pictures of puppies and nicely drawn elephants with quotations from Buddha asking you to like them and not enough challenging posts that force you to rethink and question. This list brings up material worth considering. I think it has value for the very fact that we can read Peter Riley’s reviews among a host of other things. I welcome its appearance in my in-box, as
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 09:50:39 +0100
From: Tim Allen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: This List
Yep - that's my general opinion too Jess
Tim A.
On 30 Sep 2014, at 04:00, jesse wrote:
> Discussion lists are tools. This one has certainly helped me in all kinds of ways. Sometimes one tool stays on the bench a bit longer than another, but that’s no reason to throw it away. The problem with Facebook is that you see too many pictures of puppies and nicely drawn elephants with quotations from Buddha asking you to like them and not enough challenging posts that force you to rethink and question. This list brings up material worth considering. I think it has value for the very fact that we can read Peter Riley’s reviews among a host of other things. I welcome its appearance in my in-box, as I have since 1998. Jess
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:54:29 +0100
From: Patrick McManus <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: This List
It gives ancient fogies like me who don't travel well-stuck in suburbia
leafy in cul-de-sacs -brain numbing -apathetic marshlands! A bit of
fresher air and prod now and then to wake me up from my stupors! Thanks
P old grump
From: British & Irish poets [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
Behalf Of Tim Allen
Sent: 30 September 2014 09:51
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: This List
Yep - that's my general opinion too Jess
Tim A.
On 30 Sep 2014, at 04:00, jesse wrote:
Discussion lists are tools. This one has certainly helped me in all kinds
of ways. Sometimes one tool stays on the bench a bit longer than another,
but that's no reason to throw it away. The problem with Facebook is that
you see too many pictures of puppies and nicely drawn elephants with
quotations from Buddha asking you to like them and not enough challenging
posts that force you to rethink and question. This list brings up material
worth considering. I think it has value for the very fact that we can read
Peter Riley's reviews among a host of other things. I welcome its
appearance in my in-box, as I have since 1998. Jess
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:13:12 +0100
From: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: some new books
I dipped, and found myself writing a short note about Robert's Metambesen releases..
http://intercapillaryspace.blogspot.co.uk/2014/09/greetings-to-metambesen-robert-kelly-etc.html
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:31:21 +0100
From: Peter Riley <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: some new books
This is an interesting piece but I have to say that the idea that
British poets are still, after all these years, sulking in envy of a
massive output of high quality poetry from USA which we can't live up
to, is grotesque. It's a polemic we've had to face since the 1960s and
I thought it had subsided. I find myself that what has been done and
is being done here is just as admirable as anything from across the
water, and recently rather more so.
PR
On 30 Sep 2014, at 11:13, [log in to unmask] wrote:
I dipped, and found myself writing a short note about Robert's
Metambesen releases..
http://intercapillaryspace.blogspot.co.uk/2014/09/greetings-to-metambesen-robert-kelly-etc.html
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:49:05 +0100
From: Rhys Trimble <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: This List
Might as well carry on what? I keep half an eye on it although I've only pitched in a couple of times and am usually admonished for it. Most of the debates seem to get a bit frightening - its a phenomenon of the internet it seems that every blog on every subject leads to name calling eventually. Maybe make it a more informal 'intellegencer style' document and keep things buoyant and constructive if possible. Facebook isn't ideal for poetry and neither is anything designed to be the carrier for contemporary things perhaps.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 12:09:39 +0100
From: Peter Riley <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: This List
I'm glad that has been sorted out, and the message is "Carry on", and
quite right too. The dance floor remains available whenever anyone's
feet get itchy.
I was interested in the remark that web lists tend to consolidate
people into more-or-less embattled groupings whereas Facebook doesn't.
This is true and a source of most of my discomfort on these lists --I
quit UKPoetry because everything had become so predictable, with an
undercurrent of aggression at the mere possibility of insubordination.
But Facebook is difficult to use because if you address remarks about
poetry to your "friends" that includes people not in any way involved
in poetry - cousins, neighbours, musicians, people you meet on
trains... - and you don't want to bother them with all the poetry
fuss. Unless of course you don't know anybody not involved in poetry.
I don't know any solution to these questions beyond recourse to the
written word.
P:R
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:17:39 +0200
From: Pierre Joris <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: some new books
For those of you interested in METABESEN & Kelly’s work, note also that Contra Mundum Press just published the Collected Essays of RK, edited by myself & Peter Cockelbergh (more details on my blog: http://www.pierrejoris.com/blog/?p=12368
p.s. I keep being a lurker on the list.why not keep it going as is? There is a slow-food movement, so why not a slow-list on poetry movement?
Pierre
On Sep 30, 2014, at 12:31 PM, Peter Riley <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> This is an interesting piece but I have to say that the idea that British poets are still, after all these years, sulking in envy of a massive output of high quality poetry from USA which we can't live up to, is grotesque. It's a polemic we've had to face since the 1960s and I thought it had subsided. I find myself that what has been done and is being done here is just as admirable as anything from across the water, and recently rather more so.
> PR
>
>
>
> On 30 Sep 2014, at 11:13, [log in to unmask] wrote:
>
> I dipped, and found myself writing a short note about Robert's Metambesen releases..
>
> http://intercapillaryspace.blogspot.co.uk/2014/09/greetings-to-metambesen-robert-kelly-etc.html
=================================
"It may well be the case that one has
to wait a long time to find out whether the
title of avant-garde is deserved."
— Jean-François Lyotard
=================================
Pierre Joris
cell phone: 518 225 7123
email: [log in to unmask]
http://pierrejoris.com
Nomadics blog: http://pierrejoris.com/blog/
=================================
_____________________________________________________
Coming in September, October & December:
Barzakh (Poems 2000-2012) A Voice Full of Cities: Paul Celan: Breathturn into Timestead
by Pierre Joris The Collected Essays of Robert Kelly The Collected Later Poetry
Edited by Pierre Joris & Peter Cockelbergh Translated & with commentary by Pierre Joris
Black Widow Press Contra Mundum Press Farrar Straus & Giroux
http://www.blackwidowpress.com/ / http://contramundum.net/ http://us.macmillan.com/books/9780374125981
_____________________________________________________
Pierre Joris
cell: 518 225 7123
email: [log in to unmask]
http://pierrejoris.com
Nomadics blog: http://pierrejoris.com/blog/
______________________________________________________
I don’t know if we can get rid of our “soul waste” more easily
than of our “atomic waste” — Paul Celan
______________________________________________________
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:06:14 +0100
From: "Michael J. Maguire" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Question
I concur with those who value this list, while acknowledging my own recent
inaction/lack of engagement here, I too see this list as far from 'dead'.
I agree with Jim that FB and other commercial digital social media tools
will mirror the boom n bust cycles of their predecessors.. (although I
still have friendster, delicious, hotmail & librarything accounts among my
tumbler/pinterest etc).. I'm not quite sure exactly when I joined this list
maybe only 9+ years ago and ostensibly in an effort to understand something
of the state of networked poetic discourse on these islands at that time..
a high, if not foolish, ideal born out of my late return to academia /
formal learning (an M.A. at DMU) after 20+ years writing and working in
theatre, media, & game dev. There have been some wonderfully tetchy
exchanges here during that time, when I have lurked (mostly) on the
sidelines, in wonder, aghast, surprised, informed, disgusted, completely
clueless, amazed, inspired... but somehow also reassured that there are
others out there (on here) who are 'real' poets at heart, poets at bone,
poets at breath, poets in soul.. and as such, are naturally incapable of
posting forty self promoting anodyne FB posts per week, or who, like me,
simply cannot spend day after day electronically slobbering through their
sphincter about their own work being 'of significance' very well received
on twitter or of considerable import to their FB friends list, or simply
can't be one of those constantly advocating the need for everyone in the
entire world to enlist into their bland version of a creative writing
course. In terms of an irritation scale.. this list, albeit monastic &
silent is a veritable oasis of calm among a competing ocean of doe ray sofa
me me me me me me me me me..
I also mostly agree with Sean, in recent years there has been a major
societal shift to networked culture, the existence of this list reenforces
that fact. Poetry, Prose and Creativity in general have found new outlets,
new methods, new modes and new forms of expression, Yes I too, like others,
see this list as a tool. I also see it in less utilitarian terms as a
meeting place of minds, egos, works and perhaps souls.. I just spent six
calender years at the aforementioned UCD exploring the potential for a
digital poetic.. (Bunkered down 24/7 at my home desk mostly or traveling to
physically interact with other souls) trying to find some kind of bridge
from traditional even pastoral (spiritual) poetry, through various media
incarnations, to its potential modern networked based
expression/manifestation, work using networked and standalone computers.
(opps Sphincter vicinity alert)
While there earning (& paying for) my PhD I discovered several things;
academia is an industry and like every other industry (whether it contains
lamb slaughtering, animal testing, overpaid CEOs or dodgy political
gerrymandering) it has inherent flaws, tensions, and black spots. It is
certainly motivated in great part by profits ( personal, political, &
cultural) and it only takes a few arseholes to turn it into a self
contained piranha pool. In my own personal experience there are good people
everywhere, even in black spots, and especially in academia.
Modern institutions, despite their medieval heritage, entrusted with
today's mass of rhubarbrian offspring, still appear by their very nature
conservative, inward looking and of similar personality to some of their
less likable employees. (Jon Ronson's mates spring to mind) The Irish
Research council does not, nor will it, fund creative work (unless its
dressed up as a stem app), it will fund studies of other people's creative
work, it will fund networks of academics to discuss other peoples creative
work but it does not support original research that is poetically
creatively centered. Despite being the first in my field ironically I may
well be (one of) the last Creative Writing PhDs to emerge from UCD.
Within the (Irish) education system, Industry trends appear to predominate
and the recent introduction of very costly MFA style courses will merely
add to further homogenization of outputs of which Henry Ford would be
proud. I don't complain publicly or criticize such blatant capitalist
policy because the levels of frustration at the current status quo inside
the academy are even more intense than those outside it's 'Harrowed' walls.
(Yup we wouldn't want to upset the international student 'market')
While I acknowledge certain inadequacies in terms of quality, fully
recognize the imperative for change to that system, I however see little
point in any of us standing outside throwing stones at individual
edifices.. and yet conversely there's Leonard Cohen's line 'they sentenced
me to twenty years of boredom for trying to change the system from within".
For some the academy seems absolutely necessary to allow career
progression, get a pay packet or even access to a supposedly informed
readership or some oddly amoebic quality metric. The only tradition is
change.
For others Academia is a personal journey of discovery to assess 'the state
of the(ir) art', make discoveries, comparisons, friends and maybe a few
insignificant ripples, for even more folks, i.e. many of my own personal
friends, most of whom are working class and from a border town, Academia
has become an inaccessible monolith of mystery that deserves as many stones
as we can hit it with. Part of the difficulty of the recent
widespread/exclusive association of poetry with the academy is my mere
mention of either can cause my mates to stock up on da rocks. I'm the only
one that can change that, and like any significant change, incredulously it
must begin with 'me'..... or even me me me me me me me me
MJM
On 29 September 2014 23:23, Sean Carey <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> The Facebook platform in a poetry sense has yet to really advance Aiden
> and indeed I always read your posts with real respect for your friendly
> open spirit. My own stint on Facebook goes back to 2006 or so or maybe
> earlier. It seemed at first ideal for anyone into writing but a lot has
> changed since about 2010. In a strange way it has never recovered its early
> promise with literary pages on it themselves fading which is a shame but
> interest wanes all too quickly. I would deduct the Warhol fifteen minutes
> to fifteen seconds or less in relation to attention spans rather than fame.
> Indeed Joyce's H.C.E. could not be HERE COMES NOBODY The big hitters in
> poetry have almost all walked into history with no Olson or Pound or Stein
> on the horizon. If sights are set at low altitude we never get off the
> ground in reaching the dizzy heights of the 20th century masters.
>
>
> Young writers I notice seldom contribute much and always claim to ''be
> busy'' despite vast amounts of leisure time helped by electronic advances.
> On your point on blogs etc. I am indeed aware of what is involved but
> health problems restrict me with regard to concentration. Overall I am
> tuned into cyberspace with the real advances promising a very interesting
> future. Instagram has a poetry section which is quite varied if one checks
> the # tags to look at what is going on. Twitter is now a part of modern
> living despite its relative youth offering all kinds of options. Tumblr has
> vast amounts of worthy literary data with all fields of writing
> represented. Facebook will dominate the market until a serious rival
> emerges but that will take time.
>
>
>
> Any forum has to have a dynamic to remain lively and I do like Jeff's
> contributions and many others who offer information that has value. One
> point on modern elders is the lack of autobiographical work which leaves
> holes in our grasp of their writings and lives. If everything is left to
> the academics we will see dumbed down cosmetic accounts given the current
> state of academic standards and research in Ireland and Britain. Vast
> crowded sardine tin campus sites are not ideal for worthwhile projects let
> alone suitable for human beings to study in. An eyesore like Trinity
> College in central Dublin or the bunker of University College Dublin badly
> need to be relocated and left as mere culture tourist locations to be
> viewed from the top of a bus. To see Plymouth University or Bristol looking
> like a campus that was created by Tim Burton is soul destroying. But nobody
> complains or bothers to simply say enough is enough!
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Aidan Semmens <[log in to unmask]>
> To: BRITISH-IRISH-POETS <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Mon, 29 Sep 2014 8:14
> Subject: Re: Question
>
> As a (very) latecomer to this list I've found it only in what might be
> called a decrepit condition, a little unsure what its purpose now is. It
> seems to be, in a sense, a leftover from what is now an outdated way of
> using the internet.
> Though I'm a positively addicted Facebook-user, I can however see why some
> might shun the noisier forms of social networking, and for their sake if no
> other I would consider it a shame if this list were to fade away entirely.
> Sean - much of your rather depressed-sounding post makes sense but I must
> correct one thing you say: assuming you're already internet-enabled (and
> that's obviously a prerequisite for membership of this list too) it costs
> nothing more to set up a blog or a website through Wordpress, Blogspot,
> Weebly or no doubt countless other such sites.
>
> Aidan
> www.aidansemmens.co.uk
>
>
> On Sunday, September 28, 2014 9:14 PM, Sean Carey <
> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>
>
> The list has become very low key Peter with very little input other
> than the occasional reading or book promotion listing now the stable fare.
> Healthy debate or discussion of issues relating to the current malaise
> poetry is in on both these islands is not noted.. Few of the bigger names
> who contribute the usual odd few words or notices are prepared to yield
> much or inform us what they are actually doing in a literary sense. It all
> makes for a dull platform while other social media including the Facebook
> empire provide anything other than cliques talking amongst themselves. In
> the world of 2014 few believe in anything other than self-interest which is
> extraordinary given the huge scope social media and the internet offers
> writers.
>
>
> A lot of those on here are now in their twilight years but very little
> reflection goes on to explain either the present or the past endeavours of
> their careers. The decades since World War Two offered us some remarkable
> writing which deserves discussion and debate. To disturb the list's drift
> into slumber is to be seen as a noisy old sour grapes bearer of grudges or
> an unnecessary grump. Yet clearly the list provides important information
> on worthwhile book publications as well as readings.
>
>
> Nothing is ever simple in the literary world with economics never
> addressed or explained in a clear specific way as well as casting light on
> the financial facts of life. To start a website or set-up even a modest
> publishing house or blog costs money. There are also the usual season of
> festivals where one could predict the invited readers without a crystal
> ball.
>
>
>
> I would advise any young man or woman to carefully think about letting
> poetry being anything other than a hobby unless one knows money does not
> grow on trees or grants fall like manna from the skies. A foothold in the
> academic door is necessary to bloom and network towards fame and fortune.
> Bunting's pigeon racing hobby line is apt but also pick role models very
> carefully and steer clear of gurus.
>
>
> It would be sad if the list fades away into oblivion but to inject more
> vitality into it means tackling a lot of issues and topics in an honest
> open way.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Peter Riley <[log in to unmask]>
> To: BRITISH-IRISH-POETS <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Sun, 28 Sep 2014 10:24
> Subject: Question
>
> Is it the opinion of the members of this list that it is defunct?
> Irrelevant to the monastic isolation and silence of British & Irish
> poets these days? Replaced by FaceBook? Died of fatigue or boredom?
>
>
>
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:24:31 +0100
From: Aidan Semmens <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: This List
My solution to the problem you identify, Peter, is to to have two Facebook accounts - one for poets and one for family and other friends. It seems to work OK. Sometimes I want to post to both, but that's not difficult.
The biggest trouble I have with Facebook is that you can never be sure who is actually seeing what, as posting on ones wall certainly doesn't seem to reach all ones friends.
Aidan
www.aidansemmens.co.uk
On Tuesday, September 30, 2014 12:09 PM, Peter Riley <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>
>I'm glad that has been sorted out, and the message is "Carry on", and
>quite right too. The dance floor remains available whenever anyone's
>feet get itchy.
>
>I was interested in the remark that web lists tend to consolidate
>people into more-or-less embattled groupings whereas Facebook doesn't.
>This is true and a source of most of my discomfort on these lists --I
>quit UKPoetry because everything had become so predictable, with an
>undercurrent of aggression at the mere possibility of insubordination.
>But Facebook is difficult to use because if you address remarks about
>poetry to your "friends" that includes people not in any way involved
>in poetry - cousins, neighbours, musicians, people you meet on
>trains... - and you don't want to bother them with all the poetry
>fuss. Unless of course you don't know anybody not involved in poetry.
>I don't know any solution to these questions beyond
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:39:06 +0100
From: Tim Allen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: some new books
Ah, at last, something to bite back on. Thanks Peter.
I don't think we 'sulk' about it and I don't think I'd use the word 'envy' as Michael suggests, but I would say that the "steady flow of attractive poetry coming out of the US" does make some of us think about the situation in a different way than if there were not that 'river', as Michael calls it. Some British poets, and I think I'd include myself among them, have been more influenced by American poetry, in general, than English. I'm not saying that to put down English poetry or anything so silly but to simply point out that not all of us are in the same relationship to this thing as Peter is. Some aspects of this situation are so obvious that surely they don't need saying - the size of America and the bulk of poetry coming out of it is always going to be a factor.
Speaking just about my own tastes it is a fact that percentage wise I find more American poetry that I find attractive than English, and of course that American poetry mostly comes from post modern and post language circles etc. There is a lot more of it than equivalent British stuff.
Up until recently the Manchester Waterstones carried a really good variety of poetry which included more American and translated material than you would normally find in Waterstones. But then they cut their poetry shelves by over a half and guess what poetry no longer appears there so much? - yes of course, the American and translated. I used to always find something of interest there to read but that is rare now - the Brit stuff there that I like is stuff that I usually already have on my own shelves etc.
Pick up a book by an English name I've never heard of, read a few lines and know almost immediately that my poetry antennae are not being stimulated. This happens time and time again.
Don't worry Peter, I won't use the word 'mainstream' here... UPS!
There that's a big enough bite for the moment.
Cheers
Tim
On 30 Sep 2014, at 11:31, Peter Riley wrote:
> This is an interesting piece but I have to say that the idea that British poets are still, after all these years, sulking in envy of a massive output of high quality poetry from USA which we can't live up to, is grotesque. It's a polemic we've had to face since the 1960s and I thought it had subsided. I find myself that what has been done and is being done here is just as admirable as anything from across the water, and recently rather more so.
> PR
>
>
>
> On 30 Sep 2014, at 11:13, [log in to unmask] wrote:
>
> I dipped, and found myself writing a short note about Robert's Metambesen releases..
>
> http://intercapillaryspace.blogspot.co.uk/2014/09/greetings-to-metambesen-robert-kelly-etc.html
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 07:57:21 -0500
From: mIEKAL aND <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Question
Hilarious that a question asking if the list is dead and has the discussion moved to Facebook generates new found solidarity. This exact same thing played out this week on two other mailing lists that I'm on, tho both lists devoted to horticulture and fruit and nut exploration, the discussion-commenting has played out in an identical timbre. Huzzah!
~mIEKAL
on lists, on Facebook, on Ello, on Twitter, on G+, on Dispora, in email, on the web, in print, over his head
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 08:34:23 -0500
From: mIEKAL aND <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: This List
I'm not understanding why it would matter who saw your posts about poetry. It's a stream, everything comes and goes and if it's not interesting to someone and they don't interact with it, typically it won't continue to show up in their stream. You could also use hashtags and then people that want to target your posts about poetry or anything else for that matter could click on the hashtag and see everything you've ever posted using the particular hashtag.
~mIEKAL
On Sep 30, 2014, at 7:24 AM, Aidan Semmens wrote:
> My solution to the problem you identify, Peter, is to to have two Facebook accounts - one for poets and one for family and other friends. It seems to work OK. Sometimes I want to post to both, but that's not difficult.
> The biggest trouble I have with Facebook is that you can never be sure who is actually seeing what, as posting on ones wall certainly doesn't seem to reach all ones friends.
>
> Aidan
> www.aidansemmens.co.uk
>
>
> On Tuesday, September 30, 2014 12:09 PM, Peter Riley <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>
> I'm glad that has been sorted out, and the message is "Carry on", and
> quite right too. The dance floor remains available whenever anyone's
> feet get itchy.
>
> I was interested in the remark that web lists tend to consolidate
> people into more-or-less embattled groupings whereas Facebook doesn't.
> This is true and a source of most of my discomfort on these lists --I
> quit UKPoetry because everything had become so predictable, with an
> undercurrent of aggression at the mere possibility of insubordination.
> But Facebook is difficult to use because if you address remarks about
> poetry to your "friends" that includes people not in any way involved
> in poetry - cousins, neighbours, musicians, people you meet on
> trains... - and you don't want to bother them with all the poetry
> fuss. Unless of course you don't know anybody not involved in poetry.
> I don't know any solution to these questions beyond recourse to the
> written word.
> P:R
>
>
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 16:42:57 +0100
From: Patrick McManus <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Question
'horticulture and fruit and nut exploration'! Now that sounds interesting
P-nut
-----Original Message-----
From: British & Irish poets [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
Behalf Of mIEKAL aND
Sent: 30 September 2014 13:57
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Question
Hilarious that a question asking if the list is dead and has the discussion
moved to Facebook generates new found solidarity. This exact same thing
played out this week on two other mailing lists that I'm on, tho both lists
devoted to horticulture and fruit and nut exploration, the
discussion-commenting has played out in an identical timbre. Huzzah!
~mIEKAL
on lists, on Facebook, on Ello, on Twitter, on G+, on Dispora, in email, on
the web, in print, over his head=
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 16:51:46 +0100
From: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: some new books
Hi Peter,
Well I would hesitate to describe US poetry as more admirable than UK poetry, or vice versa. What I envied was not the poetry as such, (that's a different matter), but what I sense as a sort of shared confidence in a directly applied modernist poetic, a lack of poetic hang-ups maybe, something that liberates expression in what seems a direct and non-precious non-self-conscious way; this at least is how it strikes me as as a UK onlooker. I'm aware that I'm proliferating stereotypes and that I could name US poets who make a different impression; but I'm happy that Tim knew exactly what I was talking about. There's probably a grass-is-greener effect. And where the grass is indeed greener there's no doubt a corresponding price to pay. I think that some kinds of poetry only thrive on stony ground.
Best,
Michael
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 17:01:12 +0100
From: Angus Sinclair <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Book launch: 'And After This I Saw : Selections from the work of Julian of Norwich' by Edwin Kelly
Hello,
I hope those of you interested in literary translation will be able to attend the launch of 'And After This I Saw : Selections from the work of Julian of Norwich' by Edwin Kelly, a new pamphlet from Gatehouse Press<http://gatehousepress.com/>. There is blurb below. After the reading there will be a Q&A session and light refreshments. Attendance is free but booking is essential. Please RSVP by Friday 24th October to: Angus Sinclair on 0207 898 1263 or by email [log in to unmask]. Entry will be via the gatehouse opposite Lambeth Bridge. Promised blurb:
What if we thought of God as distress and not comfort? In this new selected edition of the work of Julian of Norwich, poet Edwin Kelly gives us a fresh take on the experiences that Julian recorded so passionately after rising from what she believed was her deathbed. Kelly explores how the difficulty of approaching God in language can become an integral part of the process of revelation. Through interleaving different manuscript versions of Julian's work we are lead on a journey that entwines the history of the Showing of Love with its physical presence. Sometimes raw and gripping, sometimes tender, Kelly's versions of Julian's work reveal the poetry that lies in Julian's search for meaning in her visions.
Edwin Kelly grew up in Limerick, Ireland, but now lives in Dublin. His poems and translations have appeared in the UK and Ireland. He studied creative writing on the MA programme at the University of East Anglia, and is the writing editor for the translation website VerseJunkies.
And at the risk of making this list redundant there is a Facebook event page<https://www.facebook.com/events/1526435954268973/> for it too. The author has also blogged here<http://www.gatehousepress.com/2014/08/julian-of-norwich-as-poet/> on Julian's influence on various poets.
Kind regards,
Angus
Angus Sinclair
Library Assistant
Lambeth Palace Library
London
SE1 7JU
http://www.lambethpalacelibrary.org<http://www.lambethpalacelibrary.org/>
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Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 21:50:53 +0100
From: Tilla Brading <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Question
Hi Carrie,
Yes, 'tis so! but I suppose it means the anthology shows a spread of work … look on the bright side!
Tilla
Tilla Brading
[log in to unmask]
On 29 Sep 2014, at 09:11, Carrie Etter <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
I'm here, Peter, and enjoy lurking. Admittedly, my other commitments often keep me from doing more than that, but I'm happy to participate in a conversation when so moved.
Tilla, I've had that happen with an anthology or two--usually because the quality promised wasn't delivered. Is that the source of regret for you--if you don't mind my asking?
Cheers,
Carrie
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End of BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Digest - 29 Sep 2014 to 30 Sep 2014 (#2014-155)
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