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I believe the same Dawn and always have. I think things do happen for a reason. I have been questioning myself if Occ health is what I want to carry on doing for a while now. Maybe this is the major push that I have needed to make that decision. Karen Occ Health Advisor RGN OHND Paradigm Precision Burnley 1 Bentley Wood Way Network 65 Business Park Hapton, Burnley Lancashire UK BB11 5TG Direct Dial +44 (0) 1282 47 8722 [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Paradigm Precision – Burnley is a trading name of Unison Engine Components Ltd Registered Number 5137829 England VAT Reg No GB 174 2910 09 All quotations, estimates, orders or acknowledgements of orders are subject to the Company's standard Terms and Conditions, copies of which are available on request. This e-mail is confidential and is intended for the exclusive attention of the addressee(s) indicated. Any opinions or advice given are not necessarily those of the company from which the e-mail was sent. If you are not the intended recipient, this e-mail should not be read or disclosed to any other person. Please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail from your computer system. Although this e-mail has been checked for viruses and other defects, no responsibility can be accepted for any loss or damage from its receipt or use. From: [log in to unmask] [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Dawn Veal Sent: 05 June 2014 10:01 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query As you say do you really feel engaged after this….I agree it is hard to pull back from a feeling of being undervalued like this but I am a great believer in karma and that something better is around the corner. ☺ D From: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Huyton, Karen (GE Aviation, Non-GE) Sent: 05 June 2014 09:49 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query Thankyou Dawn for your advice and support. I am speaking to the RCN again tomorrow and I will ring Acas. I intend to fight all the way, but if I lose the battle then yes I will be looking for alternative employment. My loyalty to the company has taken a battering and not sure I will ever feel the same again working here regards Karen L Huyton Occ Health Advisor RGN OHND Paradigm Precision Burnley 1 Bentley Wood Way Network 65 Business Park Hapton, Burnley Lancashire UK BB11 5TG Direct Dial +44 (0) 1282 47 8722 [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Paradigm Precision – Burnley is a trading name of Unison Engine Components Ltd Registered Number 5137829 England VAT Reg No GB 174 2910 09 All quotations, estimates, orders or acknowledgements of orders are subject to the Company's standard Terms and Conditions, copies of which are available on request. This e-mail is confidential and is intended for the exclusive attention of the addressee(s) indicated. Any opinions or advice given are not necessarily those of the company from which the e-mail was sent. If you are not the intended recipient, this e-mail should not be read or disclosed to any other person. Please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail from your computer system. Although this e-mail has been checked for viruses and other defects, no responsibility can be accepted for any loss or damage from its receipt or use. From: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Dawn Veal Sent: 05 June 2014 08:31 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query Karen, I agree with all the other replies to date and add the following. Whilst I think that this appears to be appalling ( as Lindsey says though hard to judge as we don’t know what they are benchmarking you against or your present salary). But after the recent recession many companies want more and more for less and less and your company is no exception except it appears rather more severe. But I do sympathise. I have found though that you have two choices accept it or call their bluff as whether you are right or not becomes irrelevant in the end and it is unlikely they would back down now. If you can find alternate work then perhaps consider it (after taking legal advice) because even if they do relent until they replace you they won’t know what they had will they? Quite often I have seen services cut and a year or so later they realise it’s a big mistake and are in a mess. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and as you have been there so long they won’t see it trust me on that one! You can always document your reasons for leaving and that if they change their mind you could leave the door open for them to come back? ACAS are always useful to talk to for free…. Never easy and I don’t envy you right now. Good luck Dawn From: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Huyton, Karen (GE Aviation, Non-GE) Sent: 03 June 2014 12:13 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query Thankyou Wendy I really appreciate your reply. I think you are spot on when you say that we do take a lot more on. Then it becomes the norm and expected when really is out of the remit just for Occ Health advisor role. I don’t get holiday, or sick pay. I have an accountant and pay him to sort tax and NI. Over the 15 years I have had to go with four sales of the business, reduced hours, increased hours, extra work. I have just got on with it. Done extra training developed new skills. But never in this world did I ever expect this huge pay cut and still be expected to carry on, Especially when they cut my hours as well from last October. So putting the two together if they put this in place I will be doing the same job for 49 percent of the wage I earned a year ago!. I really can’t see a way forward with the business. Karen Occ Health Advisor RGN OHND Paradigm Precision Burnley 1 Bentley Wood Way Network 65 Business Park Hapton, Burnley Lancashire UK BB11 5TG Direct Dial +44 (0) 1282 47 8722 [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Paradigm Precision – Burnley is a trading name of Unison Engine Components Ltd Registered Number 5137829 England VAT Reg No GB 174 2910 09 All quotations, estimates, orders or acknowledgements of orders are subject to the Company's standard Terms and Conditions, copies of which are available on request. This e-mail is confidential and is intended for the exclusive attention of the addressee(s) indicated. Any opinions or advice given are not necessarily those of the company from which the e-mail was sent. If you are not the intended recipient, this e-mail should not be read or disclosed to any other person. Please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail from your computer system. Although this e-mail has been checked for viruses and other defects, no responsibility can be accepted for any loss or damage from its receipt or use. From: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Susan Morley Sent: 03 June 2014 11:58 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query Hi Karen I have followed your dilemma with interest. There are a lot of us that work without the support of an OHP especially the self employed amongst us. Nowadays its just part of what we do if we feel competent to do so.The OHA role has changed so much over the years and because of degree training we take on a lot more responsibility than we used to. Unfortunately as always in nursing the salary rarely reflects our worth to an organisation and often then don't fully appreciate the responsibility we have to shoulder. Prior to being self employed I earned, if I was honest, a fairly inflated salary thanks to the organisations pay scale structure (non NHS) . My successor who had run a far larger OH department than me, started on a much lower salary and had to assume all of the responsibility I had had. However to propose a 32% pay cut seems harsh in the extreme. Do you get paid annual leave, sick pay, training allowances, pay your own Tax and NI and the employers contribution, all that has to be taken into account being self employed. You have to weigh up whether you would be able to earn the same being self employed out of that organisation. The OH mags and agency's regularly advertise OH posts so you would be able to get some sort of feel for the current OH market. Maybe that's where they have come up with a figure for an OH salary failing to realise you have the employers overheads to take into account. I wish you luck with your battle, however I get the feeling you will have to compromise or move on. Harsh I know. Life isn't fair.( Dr Steven Peters. The Chimp Paradox. 2012) Fantastic read!! Sue From: "Huyton, Karen (GE Aviation, Non-GE)" <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Sent: Tuesday, June 3, 2014 8:46 AM Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query Hiya Wendy I will still be self-employed.. I do the Occ health advisor role without any support form an OHP. This is the reason why they have always paid me a higher hourly rate. Since he left the business I have covered his role with a very occasional external referal . regards Karen Occ Health Advisor RGN OHND Paradigm Precision Burnley 1 Bentley Wood Way Network 65 Business Park Hapton, Burnley Lancashire UK BB11 5TG Direct Dial +44 (0) 1282 47 8722 [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Paradigm Precision – Burnley is a trading name of Unison Engine Components Ltd Registered Number 5137829 England VAT Reg No GB 174 2910 09 All quotations, estimates, orders or acknowledgements of orders are subject to the Company's standard Terms and Conditions, copies of which are available on request. This e-mail is confidential and is intended for the exclusive attention of the addressee(s) indicated. Any opinions or advice given are not necessarily those of the company from which the e-mail was sent. If you are not the intended recipient, this e-mail should not be read or disclosed to any other person. Please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail from your computer system. Although this e-mail has been checked for viruses and other defects, no responsibility can be accepted for any loss or damage from its receipt or use. From: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wendy Sent: 02 June 2014 21:37 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query Hi Karen Could I just clarify, with the proposed role / rate, will you be employed or still self employed? Kind regards Wendy Wendy Stimson-Ladd RGN SCPHN (OH) Director AWL Occupational Health Ltd Occupational Health, Workplace Mediation and Coaching Tel: 01293 532477 Mob: 07814 288642 Website: http://www.awloh.co.uk/<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v1/url?u=http://www.awloh.co.uk/&k=RjJLq6b3Zyt2uZDzSWkh%2Bw%3D%3D%0A&r=wXuzOhjUxnqNWzIUjflfT%2FETVkypyh2vSQMgEC%2FgFFE%3D%0A&m=VaOE%2FP%2BjOKu8RKxKBMRhq%2FZWkS6n1ur4yjHJ16NoxMQ%3D%0A&s=8ed85d5fff0733ec069f6bfb471ee4bb23971f61bf6ace9a21308796a8043ee7> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=77137393&trk=tab_pro<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v1/url?u=http://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id%3D77137393%26trk%3Dtab_pro&k=RjJLq6b3Zyt2uZDzSWkh%2Bw%3D%3D%0A&r=wXuzOhjUxnqNWzIUjflfT%2FETVkypyh2vSQMgEC%2FgFFE%3D%0A&m=VaOE%2FP%2BjOKu8RKxKBMRhq%2FZWkS6n1ur4yjHJ16NoxMQ%3D%0A&s=0db0360908d90997e2c3dcea3dc9e109fae7ba59e15ac6e47be57af60af88316> Based in West Sussex AWL Occupational Health Ltd is a Company registered in England and Wales. Registered number: 7380521 Registered office: The Apex, 2 Sheriffs Orchard, Coventry. CV1 3PP Please be advised that all e-mail communication relevant to assisting in the management of the OH process will be entered into the individual's OH file. This may therefore be disclosed to the client under the Data Protection Act (1998) On 2 Jun 2014, at 19:13, Karen Coomer <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote: Hi Karen I don’t think I have anything to add from when I replied last time, I think the main point was to check your legal position as you may be seen (legally) as an employee rather than a contractor if you have worked there 15 years. I attach a link with some information and contacts which you may find useful http://www.cab.org.nz/vat/eb/ea/Pages/IndependentContractors.aspx<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v1/url?u=http://www.cab.org.nz/vat/eb/ea/Pages/IndependentContractors.aspx&k=RjJLq6b3Zyt2uZDzSWkh%2Bw%3D%3D%0A&r=wXuzOhjUxnqNWzIUjflfT%2FETVkypyh2vSQMgEC%2FgFFE%3D%0A&m=VaOE%2FP%2BjOKu8RKxKBMRhq%2FZWkS6n1ur4yjHJ16NoxMQ%3D%0A&s=c3d91f601ef40be1b8536532b4612006e2ce48c5876310b12172ee27919fad82> Best regards Karen From: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Huyton, Karen (GE Aviation, Non-GE) Sent: 02 June 2014 17:28 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query Sorry to jump in mid conversation again. I am still needing help . I am still having a major debate with my employer. I say that I do work outside of my Occ health advisor remit and therefore should be able to keep my current hourly rate. The proposed decrease is 32 percent. I will not be able to sustain a pay cut this large. Also they will not let me join the onsite union as I am a contractor and therefore self-employed. Neither will they allow the RCN on site. I have worked here for 15 years and have never been asked to take a pay cut. We have recently been bought by another business who have already cut my hours. Have any of you got a job description of your Occ Health Role. Also with this role would you have the back up and support of an OHP or not regards Karen L Huyton Occ Health Advisor RGN OHND Paradigm Precision Burnley 1 Bentley Wood Way Network 65 Business Park Hapton, Burnley Lancashire UK BB11 5TG Direct Dial +44 (0) 1282 47 8722 [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Paradigm Precision – Burnley is a trading name of Unison Engine Components Ltd Registered Number 5137829 England VAT Reg No GB 174 2910 09 All quotations, estimates, orders or acknowledgements of orders are subject to the Company's standard Terms and Conditions, copies of which are available on request. This e-mail is confidential and is intended for the exclusive attention of the addressee(s) indicated. Any opinions or advice given are not necessarily those of the company from which the e-mail was sent. If you are not the intended recipient, this e-mail should not be read or disclosed to any other person. Please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail from your computer system. Although this e-mail has been checked for viruses and other defects, no responsibility can be accepted for any loss or damage from its receipt or use. From: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Teresa Goodyear Sent: 30 May 2014 12:52 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query HI Sue, Excuse the ignorance but where in this report does it state that this affects voice or vocal chords? I would have thought that you may possibly have more than one person with symptoms if this was a problem in the building. Regards Terri Terri Goodyear Occupational Health Advisor CBS WREF Services Johnson Controls on behalf of GSK Email [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Mobile +447772 910272 Tel +441920 883853 (Ware) or +441438 790290 (Stevenage) This message is for the named person's use only. It may contain confidential, proprietary or legally privileged information. No confidentiality or privilege is waived or lost by any mistransmission. If you receive this message in error, please immediately delete it and all copies of it from your system, destroy any hard copies of it and notify the sender. You must not, directly or indirectly, use, disclose, distribute, print, or copy any part of this message if you are not the intended recipient. Please be advised that all e-mail communication relevant to assisting in the management of the OH process will be printed and entered into the individual's OH file. This may therefore be disclosed under the Data Protection Act (1998). From: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Sue Mann (NBI) Sent: 30 May 2014 08:59 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: [OCC-HEALTH] previous query Dear All, Some time ago I posted a query regarding a member of staff who has developed a problem with her voice etc. when working in a particular building. When she has been exposed to her office again her symptoms were worse. She has also tried sitting in other offices in the same building, some with air con and some not and unfortunately her symptoms returned although not so severe. The person in question sent me this report and I wondered if any of you could take a few minutes to read it and let me know your thoughts? http://www.survivingmold.com/docs/Berndtson_essay_2_CIRS.pdf<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v1/url?u=http://www.survivingmold.com/docs/Berndtson_essay_2_CIRS.pdf&k=RjJLq6b3Zyt2uZDzSWkh%2Bw%3D%3D%0A&r=wXuzOhjUxnqNWzIUjflfT%2FETVkypyh2vSQMgEC%2FgFFE%3D%0A&m=VaOE%2FP%2BjOKu8RKxKBMRhq%2FZWkS6n1ur4yjHJ16NoxMQ%3D%0A&s=fb15992f7294a44c8390cfbb13b2e8c2d7bfa2b7af606b3cb9b70a4c194d5cbf> many thanks Sue Mrs Sue Mann Occupational Health Manager JIC/IFR/NBI/TSL/TGAC Norwich BioScience Institutes Tel: 01603 450564 Fax: 01603 450029 ******************************** Please remove this footer before replying. 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