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A very useful read John, Thank you, Roberta From: John Burton Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2014 8:13 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] ageing health conditions and OH advice attaching some info to read which MAY be of interest and relevant at this point .....? John On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 12:55 PM, Hawkins, Matthew X <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Hi Karen, I had similar issues working for a mental health trust, where many of the ‘ageing’ workforce struggled to complete the necessary training for ‘control and restraint’. Some would be defined as disabled within the meaning of the EqA, but not all. In some environments, almost all staff were on restricted duties, putting obvious strain on resources and impacting safety. Having a retirement age in these settings would certainly help and may be justifiable, but as you say this will likely require a test case. There will still be those who are capable and wish to continue after a set retirement age of course. Another related question. Have the ages of retirement changed for any of the occupations who have these, particularly since the abolition of the default retirement age? I served in the Army prior to becoming a nurse and it was 22 years service from age 17 way back then. I don’t think you could stay on after this (as a non-commissioned rank), but I’m sure this is not the same now. If someone is capable and wishes to remain in service, is there a process for this? Has anyone brought a claim for discrimination based upon age? Can those who support occupations with a retirement age please let us know what happens now? Matt From: [log in to unmask] [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Karen Coomer Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 6:37 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] ageing health conditions and OH advice Hi Matt Its healthcare workers and a growing list who cannot do certain physical tasks after having a functional assessment. Where I am with this (after taking advice) is that if someone has a health condition then it is covered by the disability provisions not both disability and age. They would be looked at separately as dual discrimination is not yet law. However, it is perfectly legal to bring in a contractual retirement age if it can be justified for workforce planning but the risk is that it could be seen as avoiding difficult decisions. From an OH viewpoint I have advised that whilst I could say that a condition, such as a degenerative musculoskeletal condition, is likely to get worse due to ageing it is more difficult with other health conditions as there is little research evidence to back this up. Lifestyle seems to dictate how well someone will cope with ageing and also certain health conditions. There is evidence to state that aspects such as night work is more difficult for older workers due to fragmented sleep patterns and generally we know that flexibility and strength declines with age but other than that it is difficult to provide evidence based advice on specific health disorders. I think this will be going legal - so we shall see, maybe a test case outside the usual occupations that have compulsory retirements ages. Regards Karen From: [log in to unmask] [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Hawkins, Matthew X Sent: 10 February 2014 15:55 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] ageing health conditions and OH advice Hi Karen, An interesting one! I haven’t been asked anything similar, but have been asked to advise on the justification for age-related health assessment – a little easier. Of course certain health conditions are associated with ageing, but incidence cannot be applied to populations with any degree of certainty or linear scale. In relation to setting a retirement age, I guess it will depend upon what an ET or EAT assess in relation to that proportionate means of achieving that legitimate aim. I’m not sure if anything like this has been tested yet. From what you say, we are talking physically active roles. Where that is a vital requirement of the role, e.g. emergency services or Armed Forces, I can see why this question would be asked. Although physiologically, we deteriorate with age, we don’t do so uniformly, associated with a specific age. Increased health assessment with age is probably justifiable, but I suspect a retirement age is not. I know that there are some on jisc who work in these environments, so perhaps they could enlighten us as to what they do, if anything. The other end of that spectrum in this context, would be something where ‘youth’ is vital to a role, e.g. modelling certain products, when youth is ‘part of the brand’. Setting an age limit, may in these circumstances be a proportionate means of achieving that legitimate aim – but I’m sure would be challenged. This example may be slightly spurious, as I guess employment contracts are different in those environments. Matt From: [log in to unmask] [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Karen Coomer Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 8:26 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [OCC-HEALTH] ageing health conditions and OH advice I have been asked by a customer to provide advice on whether a health condition is associated with ageing, similar to advice on whether a condition is likely to fall under the EQ. They are coming from the fact it is a protected characteristic under the EqA and want to make a case for setting retirement age via justification as a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim (in their case workforce planning as many of the older workers are restricted from certain physical duties). Has anyone else been asked to do this as part of case management or indeed does it routinely? I have my own thoughts on whether this is appropriate but would be interested to hear other views or experiences. Many thanks Karen ******************************** Please remove this footer before replying. OCC-HEALTH ARCHIVES: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/occ-health.html CONFERENCES AND STUDY DAYS: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/filearea.cgi?LMGT1=OCC-HEALTH ******************************** Please remove this footer before replying. OCC-HEALTH ARCHIVES: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/occ-health.html CONFERENCES AND STUDY DAYS: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/filearea.cgi?LMGT1=OCC-HEALTH ******************************** Please remove this footer before replying. 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