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[log in to unmask]" type="cite">It's odd when someone reports on a non-standard construction and the response of another linguist - on the Variationist List, no less - is to say "it doesn't exist".
But if you take what is likely to be a common example sentence, let's say, "je sais pas c'est qui", while this is utterly unacceptable in standard French, there are indeed thousands and thousands of Google hits for it.
That is to say, I never came across these constructions before either, but so what? They do seem to exist.
On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 6:59 PM, Marc FRYD <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Dear Maria,
Are the labels of "Colloquial" and "spoken" not applied a bit loosely here?
I ask because examples (A) and (B) if assumed to be genuine embedded questions --and not (at least for some of them) sequences of two independent sentences (#je ne me souviens plus# #j'avais dit quoi?#-- strike me as doubtful, save in L2 French. (I know nothing about Reunion French.) I certainly have ever come across any of these from L1 speakers of French. Now the case of (C) is altogether different, and is a well-known feature of substandard French all across France, where QUE may be favoured over standard DONT, in "le magasin que je te parlais" (= the shop that I was telling you about). This feature strikes me as somewhat comparable, in terms of register, to that of relative WHAT in London English, as in 'the shop what I was telling you about'.
Best,
Marc
On 17/12/2013 15:25, Maria Secova wrote:
Dear all,
Could anyone point me to any literature on embedded Qs in spoken French (or anything else that might be relevant)?
There seem to be 3 types of such constructions in our data from the Multicultural London English - Multicultural Paris French project:
(A) forms with 'quoi' instead of 'ce que':
- je me souviens plus j'avais dit quoi
- je sais pas si vous savez ça veut dire quoi
- donc les parents ils savent ça veut dire quoi
- tu sais ils ont dit quoi
(B) forms with clause-final 'qui', 'comment', 'combien' etc.):
- je vois pas c'est qui
- lui tu sais on l'appelle comment ?
- je sais même pas c'est où
- est-ce que tu vois c'est qui (..) ?
- on comprend direct c'est quel personnage
- lui tu sais on l'appelle comment ?
- je sais plus c'était combien ..
And (C) forms with 'qu'est-ce que' instead of 'ce que':
- t'as vu qu'est-ce que tu fais là ?
- des fois on- juste à se regarder on comprend qu'est-ce qu'on a dit et voilà ..
- mais ça se fait pas qu'est-ce qu'ils nous font aussi !
Any comments and suggestions are welcome ... merci beaucoup !
Best wishes, and Merry Christmas to all,
Maria
--------------------------------
Maria Secova
Post-doctoral researcher
Multicultural London English - Multicultural Paris French
http://www.mle-mpf.bbk.ac.uk/Home.html
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--
Dr. Marc FRYD (HDR)
http://ll.univ-poitiers.fr/etudes-anglophones/spip.php?article121&lang=fr
Faculté des Lettres et des Langues
Université de Poitiers
1 rue Raymond Cantel
86022, Poitiers, France
Tel. [33](0)5 49 45 48 11
Mob. [33](0)6 40 31 21 43
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