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John, all, Right, it's Friday, it's five-to-five so it's Crackjack! I'll round up the requirements so far with a summary, and start again next week. The first thing to say is that this work is eminently suitable for incremental changes - we'll get the low hanging fruit first. We've discussed here some very specific details of Instant UI and the scope is moving here and there (which is only right, fair play). I can certainly see why some users get turned off x509 certs ... but I'm sure we can boil this down to the essentials soon. There appear to be two main parts to this job. 1) First, we could host a UI for naive users. 2) Second, we could give them the wherewithal to admin their own UI. A lot of pros and cons for each solution type have been aired, but no show-stoppers. In either case, we need to beef up the processes around the options. Some progress has already been made. Matt already has a process for a tar-ball UI, but I need to augment it with some work on the voms entries. Matt's process also includes a CVMFS copy. That tar-ball UI process fits with the UI release process well. On similar lines, we will need a parallel process for RPM/YUM/YAIM installs that also links with the UI releases. We've also got to figure out how Yaim/VomsSnooper etc. fits into this idea. This part can be done quite quickly and cheaply. We will need to bring together various other information, such as use-cases for CertWizard, use-cases for myproxy, and general tutorials on x509 etc. Much of the data for that is held in this thread. Thanks for all these inputs. Pls keep riffing on these ideas - I can see lots of places where the documentation can be improved. Cheers again, and have a nice weekend. Steve -- Steve Jones [log in to unmask] System Administrator office: 220 High Energy Physics Division tel (int): 42334 Oliver Lodge Laboratory tel (ext): +44 (0)151 794 2334 University of Liverpool http://www.liv.ac.uk/physics/hep/