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Ah - but of course the HESA return doesn't actually mention PGCHEs but only mentions successful completion of 'institutional provision in teaching in the higher education sector accredited against the UK Professional Standards Framework'. It doesn't specify level or indeed length of provision so leaving it up to the sector. The Bath model is an interesting change in direction from the PGCert 'norm' E -----Original Message----- From: Online forum for SEDA, the Staff & Educational Development Association [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of HUGHES P Sent: 28 February 2013 13:32 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: UK PG certs: compulsory or not? To quote Chapter B3 of the Quality Code (p15): "The UKPSF provides a UK-wide benchmark by which higher education providers can demonstrate how they support staff and assure themselves that they are qualified to teach and support learning." To me, this shows that for the QAA at least, UKPSF recognition means "qualified to teach" in HE. As far as I can see the Code makes no specific mention of PGCHEs, instead: "Members of staff new to their teaching or supporting student learning are encouraged to engage in appropriate induction and mentoring opportunities made available by the higher education provider." (Chapter B3, p14). However, we may yet find that league table compilers make use of the PGCHE data when it becomes publically available through the HESA return, which would reassert the importance of a teaching qualification alongside professional recognition. Peter -----Original Message----- From: Online forum for SEDA, the Staff & Educational Development Association [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Graham Lewis [gjl] Sent: 28 February 2013 12:59 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: UK PG certs: compulsory or not? The real driver would seem to be that most institutions are now concerned with increasing the numbers of members of staff with FHEA or higher, rather than PGCerts per se. I know ofat least one institution where the PGCert was dropped in favour of an internally accredited FHEA i.e. via an HEA approved CPD Framework. True the internal rute was still supported and developmental, but (IMHO) not as much s a PGCert. Graham--- --Original Message----- From: Online forum for SEDA, the Staff & Educational Development Association [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jane MacKenzie Sent: 28 February 2013 11:23 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: UK PG certs: compulsory or not? Yes this is where we got to but as you say the HEA won't necessarily know whether the accredited provision is compulsory or even runs. We have an accredited programme (in addition to our Pg cert) that hasn't run for several years. My original query was an attempt to get a sense of whether the sector is moving away from/ towards an expectation that all new acs will obtain a pgcert early in their career in response to HESA reporting Maybe too early to tell? Cheers, Jane On 28 Feb 2013, at 10:12, "HUGHES P" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > The list of HEA UKPSF accredited provision is online -but that doesn't > say whether that provision is compulsory for anyone, or not. > > http://www.heacademy.ac.uk/assets/documents/accreditation/List_of_Curr > ently_ > Accredited_Provision.pdf > > Peter > > Peter Hughes > Head of Educational Development > Centre for Educational Development > University of Bradford > BD7 1DP > 01274 235136 > > -----Original Message----- > From: Online forum for SEDA, the Staff & Educational Development > Association [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Fran Beaton > Sent: 28 February 2013 10:05 > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: UK PG certs: compulsory or not? > > I absolutely endorse this - the HEAS must surely keep lists and > details of the programme they accredit......... mustn't they? > > Fran > > -----Original Message----- > From: Online forum for SEDA, the Staff & Educational Development > Association [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Graham Lewis > [gjl] > Sent: 28 February 2013 09:58 > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: UK PG certs: compulsory or not? > > I keep saying this, but the HEA should be able to provide us with this > sort of national picture. Most PGCerts are accredited by them or form > part of local CPD frameworks that are also accredired by HEA. > > Graham > > -----Original Message----- > From: Online forum for SEDA, the Staff & Educational Development > Association [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jane MacKenzie > Sent: 27 February 2013 15:46 > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: UK PG certs: compulsory or not? > > Hello everyone > > I know this has been discussed on the SEDA list before but can anyone > point me in the direction of some info about what proportion of UK > HEIs currently have compulsory PGCerts as part of academic probation. > Apols if there is a really obvious way of finding this... > > David Gosling's paper from 2011 > http://www.davidgosling.net/default.asp?iId=KEHLH states that 62.2% of > HEIs make the pgcert mandatory (at least on paper) but I was wondering > if there has been a shift over the past couple of years with the > changes in HEA structures and processes and the requirement in England > and Wales to report teaching qualifications to HESA. This would make > me think that the number of compulsory pg certs would be on the > increase yet with the introduction of CPD frameworks the converse > might be true. > > Any pointers/info gratefully received. > > Cheers, jane > > Dr Jane MacKenzie > Head of Academic Development Unit > > Learning and Teaching Centre > University of Glasgow > 64 Southpark Avenue, > G12 8LB > Tel: 0141-330 4863 > > The University of Glasgow, charity number SC004401