Wow…

And he shouldn’t have to be told more than once anyway. Just because someone doesn’t pick up social clues doesn’t mean that he cannot learn cos if he cannot learn he cannot work because this is unacceptable no matter the circumstances isn’t it?

Please be advised that all e-mail communication relevant to assisting in the management of the OH process will be printed and entered into the individual's OH file or copied and added as an electronic note on their electronic OH record. This may therefore be disclosed under the Data Protection Act (1998).

From: [log in to unmask] [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Carr Barnes
Sent: 19 December 2012 15:54
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] Aspergers

Hi
I read that in my researching Sue but my concern is whether extends to sexually inappropriate comments. Usually the sexually inappropriate behaviour is around not knowing boundaries of touching etc. The only reference I could find to very socially taboo behaviours was related to if they had repeated exposure to porn to a level they took the language used to be 'normal' so copied it.

The language reported is so taboo it is offending men in an environment where the language would be normally colourful at the best of times.

Regards, Carr

On Dec 19, 2012 3:27 PM, "Susan Gorton" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

See attached on ASD – “people with his condition may not understand the unwritten ‘social rules’ that most of us pick up without thinking. For example they may stand too close to another person or start an inappropriate topic of conversation” and they may “ behave in what may seem to be an inappropriate manner”

They can have difficulty “ understanding or interpreting other people’s thoughts, feelings or actions. The subtle messages that are put across by facial expression and body language are often missed.”

Sounds like your guy all right.

I once had a young boy who was legally blind but could see on a gross scale. Never really saw body language or facial expressions either and didn’t get it when people were shocked by the inappropriate things he said or did so he would keep repeating the same thing. I had some trouble explaining things to him when things went wrong in the workplace as they often do but in the end he needed someone to tell him verbally the things he was missing visually.

Sue

From: [log in to unmask] [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Carr Barnes
Sent: 19 December 2012 14:20
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] Aspergers

Were his behaviours very severe? The ones in this case include sexually degrading comments about customers, members of public etc including children.

Regards, Carr

On Dec 19, 2012 2:12 PM, "janet oneill" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

strangely enough I saw my first referral for asperges yesterday

he was diagnosed exactly the same way - following a disciplinary for gross misconduct (age 40 odd)

he now has a care plan in place with a care worker and although he struggles with targets and change at work, even with adjustment at least there are no more behavioural concerns and he is still at work

Janet

On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 1:52 PM, Carr Barnes <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi all

Just to update you I spoke to Bob yesterday,

I tried not to "colour" the assessment with Asperger's as it has not been confirmed as yet but he came across as quite dispassionate and removed from the situation and as if he was reporting back things that had be said to him e.g. he's been told he has no empathy so he now trots that out when describing his behaviour. He had poor recall for events in the past and felt his behaviour is not that bad .. that people are blowing things way out of proportion.

I've recommended the employer consider funding the assessment to expedite the process and have written to the psychologist asking for a report of her findings in relation to the alleged work behaviours and the socially taboo comments as the issue is not only whether he has a disorder but also whether the disorder explains the behaviours.

Ultimately I don;t think the employer will be able to support ongoing employment but the question is whether the exit will be via medical capability or dismissal for gross misconduct.

we shall wait and see .......

On 13 December 2012 17:31, Carr Barnes <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi all

I have a case next week as follows:

"Bob" is in his 40s in customer interacting logistics based role.

Up on conduct investigation at present due to complaints from colleagues and customers about making inappropriate comments about customers and colleagues including very sexually inappropriate comments.

Referred to OH and it was decided to write for a GP report as Bob was a poor historian and but did make comments about having been on antidepressants in the past and having therapy. Union rep at this point raises concerns that there may be previously unrecognised Asperger's in play.

GP report received and outlines:

- Bob first attended surgery about behavioural issues 8 years ago when he had wrecked the house and had thoughts about killing his mother. Rx anti depressants and attended CBT Anger Management... turned up in GPs again 3 years ago with further complaints of feeling angry all the time... Rx Antidepressants again. GP agrees has indicators for Asperger's and has obtained funding for assessment so has made referral for same. I am reviewing the case to discuss the GP report with Bob and make recommendations.

D./W manager today and there are no alternative roles away from customers so redeployment is a complete no no. Employee is currently on paid suspension pending outcome of the investigations.

I have all the advice about possibly accessing a job coach, doing sensitivity training etc ready to go but suspect this is going to go medical capability as the Employer is not willing to let him near customers again.

The question I haven't been able to find an answer too is whether Asperger's could really contribute to some of the behaviours described to me... mainly the comments ... some of which were of a sexual nature about children they were driving by.

Has anyone come across such socially inappropriate behaviour in this context before?

Please note I am NOT looking for advice about adjustments etc.. just about the socially inappropriate issues.

With thanks

Carr