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Well said Sharon

I'd be wary of involving counselling this way...counselling is not for everyone and you cannot be forced into it. they need an OH opinion on fitness for attending a meeting. In these cases, although I may refer to the counseling service I usually make it clear it is for possible personal support purposes only. In very exceptional cases I may suggest delaying the management process by a week or two but have only ever done so if they have literally just started medication and are reporting severe side effects. I usually just direct employee to stress management and controlled breathing leaflets on patient.co.uk.

Often it is often worth asking employee what they feel value and outcome of undue delay can be...a lot don't realise it can take place without them anyway and soon want to engage when they cop on to this.

Regards,  Carr

On Aug 19, 2012 8:28 AM, "sharon naylor" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Interesting that your dilemma arises from a case where there is pending disciplinary and the individual goes sick because of it. Then comes the inevitable situation where both "sides" try to manipulate OH for their own ends when in reality it has nothing to do with us.
 
The first fact is that disciplinary procedures and clinical issues leading to absence are two entirely different things. People will get "stressed" by these management procedures and they wont like them, and yes, that might even make them more upset by it doesnt render then "unfit" to engage with the management procedures. In fact - these procedures are the only way they can present their case so it may be better for them to engage. Being absent from work does not mean they are unfit to attend meetings unless they are psychotic, cant understand whats going on, cant follow the procedure or understand the potential outcome.
 
The second fact is that managers can continue the disciplinary in the employees absence - the employee has likely been referred by an over cautious manager who wants to blame someone else if the employee starts citing exacerbation of their medical condition
 
In the past I have only answered the questions as outlined at the end of my second paragraph and have not discussed any "counselling" or similar. I have also stated that irrespective of my opinion it may well be that the GP`s (as his patients advocate) will differ and he may well advise his patient not to engage with processes, in which case management may well need to get a wiggle on and do their job (I normally say it more politely than that)
 
Good luck - these cases are always contentious!
 

 
Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2012 23:18:57 +0100
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] Consent
To: [log in to unmask]

Thanks carr.
Would it be unreasonable for me to then send a copy via email, asking them to confirm reciept (this is there preferred method) and reply by close of play that day whether they consent or not. If they decide not to consent do I then have to advise Hr I cannot provide them with an oh report and the recommemdations I made ie counselling can not be made etc. Even though the employee asked there gp about counselling and the gp advised them to get it through work due to nhs waiting times. Therefore they would need to go back to gp to arrange. Also if they still provide me with Amra can I advise Hr the gp will act as the employees advocate therefore potentially biased / in support of the employee and there perceptions.
Ps employee absent from work now with depression after being told he would be facing disciplinary, oh assessment to determine fitness to attend disciplinary.
Thanks to all for advice so far
Adel 


Sent from my iPhone

On 18 Aug 2012, at 20:19, kate owen <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Adel,
 
I have often sent reports to the individual prior to sending straight to HR to the extent that the other day I even said to an individual I will send you the report first (I was so sure that if I hadn't they would have found something to disagree with). These individuals can then deflect the whole situation away from themselves and I find it distracts management and HR from the real solutions as they get tied up with 'but the client said it isn't true' or 'we will have to get a second opinion'.
 
Like Carr though I also ensure they have a limited time for turn around and inform them they can only 'withdraw consent' 'correct factual inaccuracies' or have their opinion relayed to HR/management in addition to the report. ie. they cannot change my advice.
 
Best wishes
Kate
 
 

From: Adel <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Saturday, 18 August 2012, 18:37
Subject: Re: [OCC-HEALTH] Consent

Thanks Tracy.
I have a feeling this case may go much further so want to ensure all is done corect.
Adel

Sent from my iPhone

On 18 Aug 2012, at 15:26, Tracy Turner <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi Adel

As far as I am aware it is only the GMC which stipulates this but as best practice most OHAs are following suit. I always ask consent to send it straigt to HR and so far I have not had anyone ask to see the report first. If someone wanted to see it I would let them though as it saves alot of fuss and bother later on if they chose to say that they were not in agreement with what was said etc. However my opinon would always remain in the report.

Tracy


-----Original Message-----
From: Adel <[log in to unmask]>
To: OCC-HEALTH <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Sat, 18 Aug 2012 15:20
Subject: [OCC-HEALTH] Consent

Hello all,
Just looking for advice, does an employee have to give their consent prior to an 
OHA being able to send a copy of the report to the referring Hr officer?

They have requested to see the OH report before it is sent to Hr.
 
Kind regards
Adel

Sent from my iPhone

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