Chris, Jeyes fluid is a mixture of high boiling tar acid (high phenols etc) and neutral oil. Its MSDS mentions it is irritant, harmful toxic as well as flammable, I think they may be much safer boiling the veg. Saying that Jeyes fluid may be preferable compared to some of the pesticides used over the years on crops.
Some of the higher phenols may persist in the soils although it is likely they would biodegrade, it could lead to a preference of the soil microflora to those organisms which can tolerate or use the above mentioned substances as a carbon sources.
Best Regards
Dr Russell Thomas
Technical Director Environment44-(0)117-933-9262 (direct)
From: Contaminated Land Management Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Taylor, Christopher
Sent: 20 July 2012 09:32
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Allotment - contamination with sewage
Hi folks
I’ve heard that some allotment holders disinfect their plots with diluted Jeyes Fluid. I imagine that this will indiscriminately kill off the all bacteria and micro-organisms in the soil, but some have been doing it for years and swear by it. Anyone come across this practice?
Regards
Christopher Taylor BSc(Hons) MSc MIEnvSc CSci
Enforcement Officer
Environment and Protection
Environment and Neighbourhood Services
Brent Council
Telephone 020 8937 5159
Fax 020 8937 5150
Brent Council - Safer Streets, Brent House, 349-357 High Road, Wembley, Middlesex, HA9 6BZ
Safer Streets: animal welfare | grass verges| licensing | parking control | pest control | pollution control | public health | public mortuary | street lighting | trees | waste enforcement
From: Contaminated Land Management Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Allison
Sent: 19 July 2012 17:23
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Allotment - contamination with sewage
Hi All
If you need some general common sense advice, not from an EHO but a humble chemist, I have looked into this issue in the past. Foods which you wash properly and cook thoroughly should not be a problem as this is generally considered sufficient to remove/ kill the pathogens, parasites and residual toxins.
On the other hand for fruits and salad stuff that are eaten raw it is recommended that you give these a miss for 10 months in the old MAFF guidance from the time untreated sludge spreading was allowed.
You are also advised to be a bit more careful about personal hygiene while working on the affected land for presumably for a similar period, washing hands before eating etc, as well as transmitting contamination in soil to your car and house, a small risk but present none the less.
It’s worth a mention that a big reason for stopping the spreading of untreated sludge was the risk of transmitting disease to grazing livestock rather than risk to human health I believe, though that is not to say that HH risks were not a consideration also.
Kind regards
John
John Allison CSci CChem MRSC SiLC
Principal Land Quality Consultant
Dominion House
Temple Court
Birchwood
Warrington
WA3 6GD
tel. +44 (0) 1925 845156fax. +44 (0) 1925 845001
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From: Contaminated Land Management Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Scott
Sent: 19 July 2012 13:46
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Allotment - contamination with sewage
Why not ask your local environmental health officer?
John Scott
Environmental Health Manager - Commercial
Three Rivers District Council
Northway
Rickmansworth
Hertfordshire WD3 1RL
Direct line: 44(0)1923 727005
Messages: 44(0)1923 776611
Fax: 44(0)1923 727024[log in to unmask]
[log in to unmask]
From: Contaminated Land Management Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of F J Westcott
Sent: 19 July 2012 13:22
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject:I would agree with Russell.
By analogy, we do not allow raw sewage to be used as fertiliser on food crops due to potential microbial contamination, so would we recommend that vegetables that have been flooded by sewage are safe to eat?
If you need something more definitive it might be worth contacting the Health Protection Agency and the Food Standards Agency.
Regards
Frank Westcott
Technical Solutions for Sustainable and Brownfield Development
Magnolia House, 15a Fore Street, Roche, St Austell, Cornwall PL26 8EP
0330 330 8015
07973 616197
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On 19 Jul 2012, at 12:48, Thomas, Russell wrote:
Dear Lisa
I would suggest that although the likelihood is that the majority of any human or zoonotic pathogens from sewage would have since died, you cannot be certain that this will be the case.
There could potentially be a risk from chemicals in the flood water as well.
I would be very cautious about eating any produce from the allotments. As a microbiologist I would not personally recommend that the affected food was eaten, and if it is to be eaten then it should only be after thorough washing and boiling or cooking at a high heat for an extended period. Microbes are very effective at getting into inaccessible places and can be buffered from the effects of heat to a certain degree. I would certainly not eat any salads. You would have to ensure that any cuts/skin diseases were covered and protected from the vegetables and the waters used to wash them.
UV light won’t be effective as it won’t get into all the inaccessible places the microbes could have entered. This is used at commercial scales for food but I don’t think it would be successful on veg.
The link attached below give a small discussion in the second to last paragraph.
Best Regards
Dr Russell Thomas
Technical Director Environment44-(0)117-933-9262 (direct)
From: Contaminated Land Management Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Lisa Maxwell
Sent: 19 July 2012 12:16
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject:Afternoon All
I have been asked by one of allotment officers if I could help him get something more concrete to advise the allotment tenants on one of the allotments affected during the flooding that occurred a couple of weeks back. Please see the query he has already posted to a forum of his own peers.
One of my allotments sites was flooded when a couple of sewer covers where lifted during wet Thursday this resulted in flooding which covered crops for about 24 hours. I have referred the tenants to the Water Company who have done the usual act of God response.
But they are sitting on the fence when it comes to advice on if the flood washed produce is safe to eat. I am aware of the U V light killing water laden germs and that land should not be cultivated. But would love to refer the tenants to more advice on if they should eat their precious produce.
Have any of you found any good source of advice that you can share with me. Many thanks, Mike
Many thanks in advance. I will collated any responses and post them in time.
Kind Regards
Lisa
L Maxwell
Contaminated Land Officer
North Tyneside Council
Consumer Protection Group
Environmental Health
Quadrant (East)
Silverlink North
Cobalt Business Park
North Tyneside
NE27 0BY
Desk location 1L/21/04
Tel. 0191 643 6642
Fax. 0191 643 2426
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