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Halvard; 'inky bits' - I wondered what had stained my hands. I like that. thanks ! dave On 30 October 2011 15:13, Halvard Johnson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > The inky bits dance flirtatiously with all that sexy whiteness. > > > Serving the tri-state area. > > Hal > > Halvard Johnson > ================ > > [log in to unmask] > http://sites.google.com/site/halvardjohnson/Home > http://entropyandme.blogspot.com > http://imageswithoutwords.blogspot.com > http://www.hamiltonstone.org > <http://www.hamiltonstone.org/> > http://sites.google.com/site/vidalocabooks/home > <http://www.hamiltonstone.org/> > Remains To Be Seen< > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1tII1LvsGmJpmLby_dyie77p3D2u2sAwcJL3TuW5T-nY/edit?hl=en_US > > > *, Remains To Be Seen (Vol. > II)< > https://docs.google.com/document/d/198kwjOUuDuROG50BpMvKu_05auLcYh1Ce03rHqsSBNE/edit?hl=en_US > > > ,** Remains To Be Seen (Vol. > III)< > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JW0nJh3tEtKzCu4hya0mYSU04EA0sz6hRM90eTgzhyw/edit?hl=en_US > > > , *Sonnets from the Basque & Other > Poems< > https://docs.google.com/document/d/16pWoy7FBSWyCLWpz0hhI-i0BOYjSBeUiqfWBmJF3g64/edit?hl=en_US > > > *, *Mainly Black< > https://docs.google.com/document/edit?id=1i_JGJ_FqQldEnUq7cwjV8giYykz_tsGbTkC2EkAP3IM&hl=en&pli=1# > > > , *Obras Públicas< > https://sites.google.com/site/vidalocabooks/halvard-johnson-obras-publicas > > > ; **The Perfection of Mozart's Third Eye and Other > Sonnets< > http://www.scribd.com/doc/27039868/Halvard-Johnson-THE-PERFECTION-OF-MOZART-S-THIRD-EYE-Other-Sonnets > > > ; **Organ Harvest with Entrance of > Clones< > http://www.amazon.com/Harvest-Entrance-Clones-Halvard-Johnson/dp/0965404390/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1283182804&sr=8-1 > > > ; **Tango Bouquet< > https://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=0ATDp6rzKkBkhZGZwand2cHdfOWc1Mnh3Zw&hl=en > > > ; **Theory of Harmony< > https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://xpressed.wippiespace.com/fall04/theory1.pdf > > > ; **Rapsodie espagnole< > https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://xpressed.wippiespace.com/rapsodi.pdf > > > ; **Guide to the Tokyo > Subway< > http://www.amazon.com/Guide-Tokyo-Subway-Other-Poems/dp/0971487316/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1283183153&sr=1-3 > > > ; **The Sonnet Project< > https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://xpressed.wippiespace.com/hsonnet.pdf > > > ; **G(e)nome <http://xpressed.wippiespace.com/fall03/genome.pdf>; **Winter > Journey <http://capa.conncoll.edu/johnson.winter.html>; > **Eclipse<http://capa.conncoll.edu/johnson.eclipse.html> > ; **The Dance of the Red Swan <http://capa.conncoll.edu/johnson.dance.html > >; > * > *Transparencies & Projections < > http://capa.conncoll.edu/johnson.transp.html> > * > > > > > On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 9:08 AM, cris cheek <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > > Hi Dave, > > > > we will just have to agree to differ about the stretching resulting in > > meaninglessness. Because performance is used in many many different way > all > > around us (from appliances and systems to sex). The point is to begin to > > distinguish between usages, rather than allow for a general and boggy and > > potentially reductive assumption to prevail. My list of names was for > those > > who say they want more complexity from hearing poetry as they get from > > seeing poetry . it's simply a beginners guide to that not a club that > > offers entry or a ist intended for any other purposes. It's indicative of > > something else than what is often meant by spoken word . a category that > i > > do push back against as spoken word often does mean a form of light or > > comedic or identity political verse or monologue in which the emphasis in > > terms of performance is placed on conventional ideas about virtuosity of > > delivery. Spoken Word then is a mode of poetic performance, but spoken > word > > does not encompass or subsume or reduce the diverse performances of > poetry. > > I was okay with the discussion of spoken word, but not so when the terms > > blurred. I, along with many others since the mid twentieth century > (artists > > and philosophers and scholars), have found performance a more interesting > > term that simply one to do with competence and measurement. > > > > Also, it's not my breathless intellectualizing (although i appreciate the > > sideswipe in the formalisation). I'm quoting someone else, quoting > someone > > else, not because i cannot think it through for myself but because i was > > pointing to the fact that a lot of people have been thinking about this > > stuff. The description of performance taken by Marvin Carlson from > Richard > > Baumann rests on more than the term consciousness. If you read that > phrase > > "consciousness of doubleness" and how he uses it, i think it's > immediately > > clear that he's not seeking to swap out one term for the other. Nor is > that > > phrase the double consciousness as introduced by W.E.B. Du Bois used to > get > > at a distinction between genuine and inauthentic selfhood; even though > that > > could be afascinating discussion to get into. Even more so in fact it > could > > be understood that Baumann's "through which the actual execution of an > > action is placed in mental comparison with a potential, an ideal, or a > > remembered original model of that action" opens fully onto all aspects of > > consciousness, including that which can be positioned as the unconscious? > > Writing, let alone writing poetry, is often an highly self-reflexive > > activity? Not always, but often? It strikes me that Baumann's definition > is > > very interesting in terms of the act of writing, particularly the act of > > writing poetry. > > > > Performance is always performance for someone, > > > > some audience that recognises and validates it as performance even when, > > as is > > > > occasionally the case, that audience is the self. > > > > > > His final phrase there would seem to apply very distinctively to poetry? > > Else i don't understand the activity that i enjoy here os posting a poem > to > > a ist and wondering what other people make of it. > > > > > > To whit - I fully understand the idea of poetry on the page and a > literary > > tradition in which a poem performs on the page and that's why i asked > Roger > > the question that i shall now ask of you: in what ways does poetry not > > perform on the page?? > > > > > > cris > > > > > > On Oct 30, 2011, at 2:33 AM, David Bircumshaw wrote: > > > > > Well, cris, I think I would go along with Roger and suggest that you're > > > stretching the term 'performance' to the point where it becomes > > meaningless. > > > We already have a term for 'consciousness': it's called, erm, > > > 'consciousness'. I think Deborah's initial inquiry on the subject > 'Spoken > > > Word', even if it begged definition, implied a much clearer notion of > > poetry > > > in performance than that. I'd take issue with the claims of that > notion, > > but > > > that's a different matter. > > > I suspect there's a kind of rejection of the autonomic unconsciousness > at > > > work in your rather breathless intellectualizing, and perhaps, > > ironically, > > > an unconscious rejection of the unconscious hinterland. I notice a lot > of > > > lists of names too: as if party invites were necessary. > > > I must insist that my earlier post did not endorse your statement about > > > 'non-western' traditions. I shall repeat with an emphasis: classical > > Chinese > > > poetry became text based to an extent that exceeds Western traditions. > It > > > retained its nursery rhyme and folk roots because it neglected sound > when > > > compared to the West; all the sophistication became focused on the eye. > > > It was a literary poetry, and, because of its intricate entwining in > the > > > class and bureaucratic structures of pre-revolutionary China, and the > > > relationship of Chinese script to heterogeneous languages of China, > very > > > decidedly not an oral poetry. > > > > > > > > > best > > > > > > dave > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > David Joseph Bircumshaw > > > "The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe > > is > > > that none of it has tried to contact us." > > > - Calvin & Hobbes > > > Website and A Chide's Alphabet > > > http://www.staplednapkin.org.uk > > > The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html > > > Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/david.bircumshaw > > > twitter: http://twitter.com/bucketshave > > > blog: http://groggydays.blogspot.com/ > > > -- David Joseph Bircumshaw "The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." - Calvin & Hobbes Website and A Chide's Alphabet http://www.staplednapkin.org.uk The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/david.bircumshaw twitter: http://twitter.com/bucketshave blog: http://groggydays.blogspot.com/