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Dear Alison, Thanks for Rick’s article. From what I see, nothing he says contradicts my point. He suggests that there are schools where venturesome and experimental designers verge on art. True enough. This has always been the case. Many interesting designers come to mind who cross the border into art – Tony Dunne and Fiona Raby, George Maciunas, Lucy Kimbell, Wolfgang Laubersheimer, Katherine McCoy … many others come to mind. All of these designers deploy artistry to shift the framework of perception in usable (or semi-useful) products, services, and visualizations. But I’d ask how many of the Dutch students can do the rest of what these others can do to solve client problems. Rick seems to suggest that this is the question. The professors can afford to work in a framework of free play. This may not be the case for the students once they go to work. There are two questions here. First, one must ask how many of these students will survive in the design business long enough to make a difference. Second, one must ask whether they learn the skills they need to work on the kinds of complex problems that designers face today. Please read Don Norman’s earlier Core77 blog again, titled, “Why Design Education Must Change.” That suggests what these students are missing. The relationship between art and design is not clear, but the appropriate and sometimes fuzzy nature of the border zone may be located at one place when students are paying tuition at design schools. It may have a far different location when clients pay designers. Warm wishes, Ken Professor Ken Friedman, PhD, DSc (hc), FDRS | University Distinguished Professor | Dean, Faculty of Design | Swinburne University of Technology | Melbourne, Australia | [log in to unmask] | Ph: +61 39214 6078 | Faculty Alison Barnes wrote: —snip— As an addition here, I have recently read Rick Poynor's piece in Print magazine in which he seems to suggest the art/design relationship is no longer so clearly defined. I'm not saying I necessarily agree, but thought it might be of interest. http://www.printmag.com/Article/Observer-A-Report-from-the-Place-Formerly-Known-as-Graphic-Design —snip—