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medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture And certainly papal intrusion into episcopal business is represented here as well. Papal Inquisitors were an interference with episcopal supervision of the moral of their flock. Andrew E. Larsen On Oct 28, 2011, at 9:28 AM, Thomas Izbicki <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > No, though confession was a "forum internum" with legal ramifications. What I mean is the friars were intruding into many aspects of diocesan life, whether a bishop's jurisdiction over heresy or a parish priest's role in annual confessions & communions under the decree Omnis utriusque sexus of Lateran IV. > Tom Izbicki > > From: "Christopher Crockett" <[log in to unmask]> > To: [log in to unmask] > Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 10:26:28 AM > Subject: Re: [M-R] Theft of metal from UK churches > > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > > From: Thomas Izbicki <[log in to unmask]> > > > I am looking at the inquisitors' role as yet another intrusion of the > mendicants into what was traditionally the work of bishops & parish priests. > > "parish priests" held court?? > > am i right in assuming that this "intrusion" more or less began with the > crusade against the Albists? > > or were there other examples of it, perhaps even pre-dating the mendicants? > > i forget when we start getting Eyetalians being introduced into the chapter at > Chartres (and, presumably, elsewhere) --before 1250, i believe-- and i've > always just assumed that that phenomenon represents an "intrusion" of papal > power into what was certainly, "traditionally," a very local institution (the > Chapter of Chartres), personnel-wise. > > there should be a study of "foreigners" in French cathedral chapters in the > 13th c., but i've never come across it. > > have to ask a reference lieberrian, i suppose... > > >The crusade issue within Europe is a messy one too, as you well know. > > well, it certainly seems to have been "messy" from the point of view of poor > Ray of Toulouse. > > c > > > From: "Christopher Crockett" <[log in to unmask]> > > To: [log in to unmask] > > Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 8:50:33 AM > > Subject: Re: [M-R] Theft of metal from UK churches > > > > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > > > > From: Thomas Izbicki <[log in to unmask]> > > > > > There were tribunals. Nicholas Eimeric in his Directorium treated the > teams > > of inquisitors in terms of judges delegates, appointed to act on case for > the > > pope locally. There is a good deal of material on judges delegate, but the > > original practice was to choose local ecclesiastics. The innovation was the > > > use of friars in work once done by bishops. In a way, this is another > > intrusion of the papacy into local situations, > > > > > > "In a way..."? > > > > you mean, as opposed to a *real* intrusion of the papacy into local > > institutions?? > > > > (i'm particular referring to the situation which prevailed during the Albi > > "crusade".) > > > > c > > ********************************************************************** > To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME > to: [log in to unmask] > To send a message to the list, address it to: > [log in to unmask] > To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion > to: [log in to unmask] > In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: > [log in to unmask] > For further information, visit our web site: > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html > ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask] For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask] For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html