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How can policies that have yet to be implemented fully explain the events of last week? What the riots might do is question the wisdom of the planned rapid reductions in public spending, including those on the police. But all this does not fall into the remit of hen unless the health impact is explicitly discussed. It is a HEALTH equity network, not an 'anything that can be moulded to my ideological outlook' network. So please, let's keep this health focussed. Thanks Adam -----Original Message----- From: Michael Shepherd <[log in to unmask]> Sender: "The Health Equity Network (HEN)" <[log in to unmask]> Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2011 09:32:20 To: <[log in to unmask]> Reply-To: Michael Shepherd <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: 'rioting' and HEN Hi all - I have to agree with Darrin that the discussions on HEN over the last couple of weeks have illuminated some of the issues around these events as well as exposing some of the fault lines in the network. Interpreting such events as they occur or in the immediate aftermath is fraught with difficulties, but the report in the Guardian linking social unrest to austerity surely places the events of the last few weeks firmly within the remit of this group. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/aug/16/austerity-programmes-cause-riots I don't think we need to be afraid of, or apologise for, disagreements within the network, these help us all develop more considered arguments in the longer run. Dr Michael Shepherd Senior Research Fellow Cardiff Institute of Society and Health School of Social Sciences Cardiff University 1-3 Museum Place Cardiff CF10 3BD [log in to unmask] 02920 870098 -----"The Health Equity Network (HEN)" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: ----- To: [log in to unmask] From: Darrin Hodgetts Sent by: "The Health Equity Network (HEN)" Date: 08/17/2011 09:02AM Subject: (Untitled) Hi Oliver, Thanks for your considered comments as moderator of the list. I have actually enjoyed the exchanges and in particular discussions around the causes of the riots and links to definitions of health. I see a direct link between the riots and health inequalities. They involve many of the same people. Public health folk in the US have argued that crime should be seen as a epidemic and treated as a public health issue. We need to look at the interrelated nature of issues such as urban poverty and outcomes such as reduced life expediencies and riots. From time to time these frustrations converge. If we define political acts of vandalism as outside the inequalities frame then we're not going to get very far. Kind regards Darrin Hodgetts Professor of Societal Psychology, University of Waikato Research Associate, Institute of Psychology, LSE On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 3:22 AM, Oliver,AJ <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Just a short note of apology for all of the email traffic over the last few days in relation to the riots. On reflection, I don't think the exchanges were really appropriate for the hen list. The reasons for the riots were clearly complex, although not at all justified. Having been both jostled by rioters and stopped by the police, I was pretty fed up with the whole thing. As Richard suggested last week, though, i suggest that we keep hen very much health equity focussed (a rule that I have admittedly breeched myself in the past). Just one clarification though - hen was never intended to be an advocacy network. It was established as a forum to discuss health equity ideas and research, and those who are not sympathetic with health equity arguments are just as welcome to comment as those who are, so long as they provide reasoned argument. So, in short, we'll monitor things a little bit from now on, and nip debates in the bud if they are not directly health equity related. Please access the attached hyperlink for an important electronic communications disclaimer: http://lse.ac.uk/emailDisclaimer