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Brilliant point. Thankfully At-bristol only ask for a couple days a week. If you're serious about getting the experience one benefots from 3 months of doing that then you can work part time, as i do, to cover your living costs. Course it's a compromise... But times are hard, and if you can mix passion with neccessity, why not? Id rather be working a bit extra now, reap the benefits (and give back) now than not have the experience and potebtially take even longer to find a job. Definitely this case is cause for concern, but at least some people dont ask for sonething unreasonable. Thanks, Michaela On Tuesday, 24 May 2011, Mico Tatalovic <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > > > > > > > "the internship I am doing in At-Bristol has given me amazing experience, great training and development, it's a massive benefit for me to have the opportunity to volunteer there, and the people I'm working with have been amazing and I've not felt taken advantage of one iota." > > > > Now imagine if you got paid on top of that as well, just wouldn't be fair.... you'd be taking advantage of them! > > > Seriously though, there are often people paid to do more or less the same thing as volunteers at such places - science communicators. > > > Also, seems to me some people put arbitrary time limits for what is considered 'ok' for unpaid work experience: say two weeks. So it's ok to be exploited for two weeks but not for two months? Does that mean anyone can survive with no money for two weeks regardless of how well-off their family is? > > > So it appears that if you call it 'volunteering' and only exploit people for two weeks at a time, it's OK to do so then.... Surely you could still run a big exploitation scheme with such restrictions in place. > > > I think unpaid work experience/internship/volunteering - of whatever length - is great for people who can afford it, but that doesn't change the social mobility argument against it. That's the whole point - that's why it's so bad - because such great benefits are given to few and those excluded are the ones who cannot afford it - not fair. > > > There's the argument for someone like Keri Hudson, who deserves to be paid for her work (and I came across similar example of several 3-month unpaid 'interns' on the go at the time in a small company), and then there the argument for those who would never be in Hudson's position in the first place, because they don't have credit cards to max out or wealthy parents to borrow money from. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mico Tatalovic, BA (Oxon), MPhil (Cantab), MSc & DIC (Imperial) > > > > > Date: Tue, 24 May 2011 19:37:03 +0100 > From: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Unpaid Intern Court Victory > To: [log in to unmask] > > Good on them, those media organisations, publishing houses, law firms and other companies looking to take advantage of young people wanting a leg-up on the career ladder to make a larger profit margin are out of order are long over-due for a kick in the rump. > > However, if you're trying to say that the discussions surrounding At-Bristol are somehow linked to this then, I refer you to my response in that discussion. In summary, I disagree, At-Bristol aren't out to make a quick buck, they have a great volunteering programme and it's a different ball game completely. I think clearly the amount of work this girl was given, and it's nature, is not fitting of work of a volunteer, and any organisation with volunteers (as the At-Bristol internship actually is and made clear, it's a voluntary role, no money has ever ever ever ever been promised) probably have (At-Bristol definitely has) a very clear aim in relation to volunteers, the sorts of work they should do, how much, etc, etc. Just to repeat what I've said a couple times now, the internship I am doing in At-Bristol has given me amazing experience, great training and development, it's a massive benefit for me to have the opportunity to volunteer there, and the people I'm working with have been amazing and I've not felt taken advantage of one iota. > > And they've not asked me once to respond to any of this by the way. In as much it's in my personality to talk loudly and openly about things I love and feel passionate about (usually science it has to be said), I've had such a great experience with At-Bristol that I just feel like I have to put my perspective (that of a volunteer) forward. > > This is a great debate to have in relation to those instances where young people are being taken advantage of and ensure that that doens't happen, and I totally respect list members' point of views in regards to that issue, but it's a little unfair I think to surround this around At-Bristol, and the great opportunities they're offering people. > > Thanks, > > Michaela. > > On 23 May 2011 16:06, Sallie Robins <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > Given recent discussions thought others might find of interest if you haven’t picked up on this already… > http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2011/may/23/unpaid-website-intern-court-victory > Sallie Robins > ABSW Science Writers' Awards 2011 now being judged. Watch this space http://www.absw.org.uk for shortlist announcement in June > I'm producing a session at the World Conference of Science Journalists, 27-29 June 2011, Doha, Qatar, http://www.wcsj2011.org - see you there > srPR > 14 Shannon Court > Dynevor Road > London > N16 0DD > 07733 330344 > [log in to unmask] > > > ********** > ********************************************************************** > Further information about the psci-com discussion list, including list archive, can be found at the list web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/psci-com.html > You may also change your settings and subscribe/unsubscribe to psci-com from the web site. > > Psci-com is part of the National Academic Mailing List Service, known as 'JISCMail'. > It adheres to the JISCMail Acceptible Use Policy: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/acceptableuse.html > and to the JISCMail guidelines for etiquette: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/etiquette.html > > Email commands: > 1. 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