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Many of the people who are commenting on your position are not making their arguments *necessarily* from secular, academic perspectives. I think we are saying that it is that complicated, and I think there are plenty of Wiccans who are firm in their beliefs, who do take a stand and who can absolutely genuinely accept other people's spiritual choices. I just don't see the need for a hard line here, and it isn't quite the logical problem I think you are setting out. Amy On Tue, Feb 8, 2011 at 3:22 PM, Ted Hand <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > I am not denying that any of these subtle, tricky, or epistemologically > sophisticated approaches to religion are interesting. > What I am wondering is why does the secular academic approach lead to a > cynical attack on the simple faith of people who really do believe in their > "spiritual choices" or membership in a religious group? I don't think I'm > attacking Wiccans when I say that some of them might really believe in their > religion. I think it's important to distinguish between those who really > take a stand for their faith, and inappropriate to pathologize them without > really studying the issue first. > > On Tue, Feb 8, 2011 at 3:16 PM, jason winslade <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >> also, an interesting theme in Charles DeLint's Forests of the Heart, in >> the same realm as Gaiman. >> >> >> ________________________________ >> From: D E <[log in to unmask]> >> To: [log in to unmask] >> Sent: Tue, February 8, 2011 5:13:37 PM >> Subject: Re: [ACADEMIC-STUDY-MAGIC] How to Cure a Witch... >> >> not an academic ref, but Neil Gaiman's American Gods has an intruiging >> take on how various immigrant races going to the new world took their gods >> with them, and *they changed* >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: janet ifimust >> To: [log in to unmask] >> Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 11:11 PM >> Subject: Re: [ACADEMIC-STUDY-MAGIC] How to Cure a Witch... >> This has been explored in other areas, on other lists - NeosAlexandria has >> explored it a bit and it's an intersting idea (I'm afraid I can't change the >> subject in this email, but it probably needs a new one). How are the gods >> affected - if at all - when believers change their beliefs about them? >> There are articles dealing with various permutations of this in some of the >> NA publications.... >> >> On 8 February 2011 21:58, D E <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >>> >>> the spoon belongs to anyone who beleives it is theirs strongly enough >>> >>> it also occurs that what do we do where an extant relgious activity takes >>> on new and 'foreign' aspects? >>> >>> one example; the aboriginal dreaming paintings which reflect the land and >>> tribal history etc of Australia, and (i think this was in a book by somebody >>> like Lyall Watson) the painter than goes to a big city or rides in a plane, >>> and on his return, paints skyscrapers and jets into his dreamtime scene- is >>> that destroying the 'real' religious stuff, the often centuries-old evolving >>> paintings, or is it toitally valid to go into the painting? >>> >>> another example- tribal island religions that developed into Cargo Cults >>> after world war 2 >>> >>> this brings in an aspect where religious belief changes within a society >>> >>> >>> *getting headache now!* >>> >>> Dave E >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Dr. Janet Goodall >> Research Fellow >> Institute of Education >> University of Warwick >> http://www2.warwick.ac.uk/fac/soc/wie/aboutus/ >> > >