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Dear all It was the word "Oyster" that finally stirred me to respond to this thread. Oyster=RFID so by that tenuous link I justify throwing a tiny spanner into the national public library service works. If we had had the foresight of our European neighbours - like the Danes for example - we would already have everything in place to be able to deliver a service that, for example, allows commuters to borrow books in Aarhus and return them in Copenhagen. (Whether that's worth having or not is of course another issue). We would be able to do that because we had implemented an infrastructure that supports such a model. RFID would have been used - from the start - to facilitate it. That's why most of the world that knows anything about RFID knows about the Danish Data Model (incidentally that really annoys the Dutch who saw the need even earlier). But in the UK we decided not to do that. We decided instead to invest in RFID solutions that effectively tie us down to a single supplier, prevent us from buying tags on the open market (because every tag has to be coded for its suppliers' equipment), make it difficult to switch supplier without either re-programming software or re-scanning every tag in our possession, and inhibit innovation (because you can only innovate with the tags and equipment supplied by just one company). So even if we tried to build the national model that Ken, Frances and I used to dream about back in the heady days of our youth, UK public libraries, by their continued investment in totally proprietary RFID solutions, have defined not only the limits of the technology's benefit to their organisations but also failed to grasp the opportunity that RFID would otherwise have made infinitely simpler to build the foundations of a national public library service. Each new public library that invests in RFID before we move to a national data standard - which partly thanks to the efforts of RFID suppliers we will be doing this year - repeats that error. Yet in the usage survey I am currently running although 95% of respondents say they are fully aware of all the issues surrounding standards the same percentage - 95%! - are unsure whether they want to use them. Actually it was that statistic, not the Oyster reference that really motivated this response now I come to think of it. Happy New Year Mick Mick Fortune m. +44 (0)7786 625544 <http://www.voicesforthelibrary.org.uk/wordpress> Make your voice heard in the public library debate! From: lis-pub-libs: UK Public Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Frances Hendrix Sent: 06 January 2011 10:29 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Kindle links-back to a national catalogue? I have been mulling over the comments on this thread, started I think by John Dolan and then David Potts.I really think we should remind ourselves what had achieved by 1990,yes 21 years ago i.e the holdings of 7 library regions BLDSC monographs and serials, a request and loan management system and the start of ISO protocol development for search/retrieve and ILL loan i.e the first project funded by the European Commission, All it lacked was a public front end, not possible because of there way it was funded. In addition the charging mechanisms for local and BLDSC national and international loans was in place. Talk about deja vu. These other ideas now popping up still need sophisticated requesting , charging and loan management facilities behind them. You are dealing with other peoples property. No good passing it around the whirly gig of library organisations. Nothing but talk will emanate from it, It wasn't done like that in the past and won't be achieved like that in the future The world could have been our Oyster, but it passed us by as we argued and fought amongst ourselves. Now what if MA had taken this up? f Frances Hendrix Martin House Farm, Hilltop Lane, Whittle le Woods, Chorley, Lancs PR6 7QR, UK tel: 01257 274 833. fax: 01257 266 488 email: [log in to unmask] ----- Original Message ----- From: Ken Chad <mailto:[log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask] Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2011 7:18 PM Subject: Re: Kindle links-back to a national catalogue? Lynda The data on web site visits is from Nielsen ( and quoted here http://www.marketingcharts.com/interactive/average-american-surfed-2554-page s-in-march-8743/). ..and you are quite right they are ‘all things internet’ (or rather web) so libraries ‘barely’ figure in that despite some local increases. The move away from the web and towards an ‘app’ based approach looks to increase that trend. Do we really need each library authority to develop their own app? (Leeds have done one) I see that we are not currently in a position to provide a national (UK) service. However if 100+ libraries can get together to provide a staff catalogue for ILL (e.g. UNITY UK or Talis Source) doing something for the public doesn’t seem too far a leap. I also see some encouraging moves towards regional services – and, as has been mentioned, national ones in Wales (and Ireland and elsewhere in Europe) for example. In England the SELMS consortium reckons to serve around 5 million people across several authorities—a good example of a shared service approach that delivers cost savings and improved services . Libraries West and London Libraries Consortium are other examples. Northern Ireland (Libraries NI) is another (non local authority run) regional service formed from previously separate authorities. These consortia could be made to interoperate..... Ken CEO, Ken Chad Consulting Ltd Tel +44 (0)7788 727 845. Email: <mailto:[log in to unmask]> [log in to unmask] <http://www.kenchadconsulting.com/> www.kenchadconsulting.com Skype: kenchadconsulting Twitter: @KenChad Open Library Systems Specifications: <http://libtechrfp.wikispaces.com/> http://libtechrfp.wikispaces.com From: lis-pub-libs: UK Public Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Lynda Bowler Sent: 05 January 2011 16:28 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Kindle links-back to a national catalogue? Agree people are probably going to fewer websites - but disagree that library catalogues don't figure at all. I guess you could argue so in the great scheme of 'all things Internet' - but our catalogue searches/visits and transactions continue to increase year on year. We're still providing a service and folk are using it. We should celebrate this. Yes we are pretty fragmented in terms of a 'national service' per se - but we're not in a position to provide an all singing, all dancing joined-up supply chain/network on the scale of Amazon, Love Film and the likes... are we? And in my opinion that's what it takes - I want to access stuff I can get - not see what's available in Glasgow. As a nation we are not good at sharing. We are all governed by local needs, rules, regulations and requirements. So why are we always beating ourselves up for providing a pretty good service albeit at a 'local level'. Big doesn't mean better (society or otherwise)! Lynda Please note that the opinions expressed in this email are personal and not necessarily those of the organisation I work for. Lynda Bowler Public Access and Web Officer (dept ITLO) Devon Libraries Great Moor House Bittern Road Sowton Exeter EX2 7NL ------------------------ Tel: 01392-385292 Fax: 01392-384316 e-mail: [log in to unmask] gmail:[log in to unmask] (urgent messages) www.devon.gov.uk/libraries Find us on: <http://www.facebook.com/Devon.Libraries> Facebook <http://www.flickr.com/photos/devonlibraries/> Flickr <http://twitter.com/DevonLibraries> Twitter Twitter @devonlibraries Currently reading... Started Early Took My Dog, by Kate Atkinson. What are you reading? -------------------------------------------------- <http://www.devon.gov.uk/email.shtml> Disclaimer THINK CARBON FOOTPRINT! - Do you really need to print this email? Save Paper - Save Money - Reduce Waste -----Original Message----- From: lis-pub-libs: UK Public Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Ken Chad Sent: 05 January 2011 15:51 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Kindle links-back to a national catalogue? The lack of a Kindle link is of course partly to do with Amazon but also to do with the fact that, on the Internet, libraries lack the ‘gravitational pull’ (a phrase used much by Lorcan Dempsey at OCLC). People are going to fewer and fewer websites and library websites/catalogues barely figure at all (something I referred to in a recent CILIP Gazette article http://www.kenchadconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/platforms_CILIP_ Gazette_2December2010.pdf). Library catalogue data remains very fragmented. So It looks like we are back in the National Catalogue’ debate again—if you aggregate data on a large scale then a range of potential benefits arise. As we discussed back in September (see the archive at https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A1=ind1009 <https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A1=ind1009&L=lis-pub-libs#48> &L=lis-pub-libs#48 about 20% of UK authorities are ‘exposing’ their holdings to Google (mostly by using OCLC -details are on the Local Government Library Technology (LGLibTech) website (https://lglibtech.wikispaces.com/National+Catalogue ) so we have a kind of/sort of 20% National Catalogue. The barriers are not really technical or even financial—indeed such a ‘shared service’ should bring opportunities for cost savings as well as service improvements. I wasn’t able to galvanise much interest back in September ..perhaps John will be more successful.... Ken CEO, Ken Chad Consulting Ltd Tel +44 (0)7788 727 845. Email: <mailto:[log in to unmask]> [log in to unmask] <http://www.kenchadconsulting.com/> www.kenchadconsulting.com Skype: kenchadconsulting Twitter: @KenChad Open Library Systems Specifications: <http://libtechrfp.wikispaces.com/> http://libtechrfp.wikispaces.com From: lis-pub-libs: UK Public Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Frances Hendrix Sent: 05 January 2011 11:22 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Kindle links Yes I remember that probably too fiddly, but a simpler version now shouldn't be too difficult. people like to do very little to get a lot f Frances Hendrix Martin House Farm, Hilltop Lane, Whittle le Woods, Chorley, Lancs PR6 7QR, UK tel: 01257 274 833. fax: 01257 266 488 email: [log in to unmask] ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Stead <mailto:[log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask] Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2011 11:19 AM Subject: Re: Kindle links In the dim and distant past (actually 2006, which seems a lifetime ago), Talis released a script for the web browser Firefox which did just what we're talking about here: if you had this thing installed on your computer and looked at a book on Amazon, it would insert a box on the web page with links to the book on the library catalogues of your choice: http://www.talis.com/tdn/greasemonkey/amazon-libraries It's a few years since I've used it, but I was pretty impressed. Yes, it relied on users having Firefox and installing an add-on script, but it worked. I've a feeling it wasn't just limited to Talis OPACs, but I could be wrong about that. I'm sure someone will correct me if that's the case. So yes, something a bit like this has been done before. It required a bit of effort on the part of the end-user - using Firefox and installing a script, which may be genuinely insurmountable barriers for some - but it was effective. Michael. Michael Stead – Transformation Officer Libraries, Heritage and Arts Wigan Leisure & Culture Trust Redgate Road, South Lancs Industrial Estate Bryn, Wigan WN4 8DT 01942 486996 (internal ext. 86996) http://wlct.org <http://wlct.org/> _____ From: lis-pub-libs: UK Public Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Moger, David Sent: Wed 05 January 2011 08:35 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [LIS-PUB-LIBS] Kindle links If you want to see this in practice look at www.whichbook.net , Opening the Book’s reader development database. Once you have chosen your book a click on “borrow” will bring up some simple screens directing you to your local library catalogue. The system even puts your search into the catalogue so you can have the location of your chosen book in 5 clicks. David Moger Stock Manager Wiltshire Libraries 01225 713716 [log in to unmask] From: lis-pub-libs: UK Public Libraries [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Dolan Sent: 04 January 2011 21:27 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Kindle links We have to keep moving forward. David Potts is absolutely right. In spite of his own strenuous efforts in this area, all the national leadership to date has failed to knock up the obvious parallel innovation to the People’s Network, namely a single catalogue and request system for UK/England public libraries. This would have been a critical gain for access and proving that public libraries in the UK mean modern business. With the demise of national leads as MLA goes and DCMS still takes no actively creative role in library development [that could of course change, Minister!] it’s left to others to make it happen. The 10 Future Libraries Programme studies involve more than 10 authorities; it will propose shared services as an economy, while claiming it’s also better. OK it’s some months before the predictable results emerge, but hey. If the studies are meant to give direction then why not coordinate a “shared” recommendation that is more than back office change, but combines efficiency and effectiveness. § Perhaps SCL colleagues would foster an interest albeit in the midst of library managers handling awful cuts and closures § CILIP could offer advocacy support and garner expertise as it has supported RFID § Surely the Arts Council will see the benefit of a coup in its first year of responsibility for libraries § Authors would surely be supportive § Would the LGA be interested in a positive distraction from the cuts? § Would UNISON see an opportunity to raise the profile and status of libraries? § Would school, college and university libraries see the massive advantage of local access to resources for everyone in learning and study? § SOCITM, looking for a chance for innovation, could support and enable § Private sector providers must surely see an opportunity – what price philanthropy, sponsorship, partnership and sustainability? Even Government [DCMS and others] might see an opportunity for a positive strategy for reading and information access – very big society, very do it yourself….. While we’re at it, why restrict this to public libraries. It can all be done. See Wales http://library.wales.org/catcymru/ or Scotland and World Cat http://www.slainte.org.uk/slaintedl.htm Thanks David. Great ideas – even the largely cost-free interims you suggest. Now, everyone else, let’s see some action! John John Dolan OBE, BA, Dip Lib, MCLIP E. <mailto:[log in to unmask]> [log in to unmask] Tw. @johnrdolan M. 07508 204200 ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. 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