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Hi again, These exchanges are from the Sainsbury website forums: https://www2.sainsburys.co.uk/YOURIDEAS/forums/thread/14397.aspx PARENT: I can not get a straight answer.... Can parents purchase alcohol with their weekly shopping when accompanied by their children in Sainsburys? With the Think 25, Everyone in the party has to prove they are 18, my children obviously can not. So where do parents stand now? I am disabled, my 14yr old daughter is my carer when I am well enough to go. My 42yr old husband was refused 2 litres of Gordons Gin last week, at lunchtime, because she did not have ID! Even after calling for a Manager and my daughter leaving the shop and my husband who had I.D. explained THREE times it was for him, he was still refused. What is going on? Have I moved from this free country without realising? Please advise? Thankyou JENNIFER@SAINSBURY REPLY: Hi there I’m sorry to hear of the incident that has occurred in your local store. In January we announced that along with the other major supermarkets, we would move to a Think 25 policy. Over the last eighteen months the focus on anti social behaviour, health service costs and crime attributed to the sale of alcohol and knives to young people has increased considerably. There is an increasing risk that through selling to someone who is underage, a colleague may be cautioned or we may lose an alcohol licence. As you mentioned, you are fully aware as this. To minimise the serious risk of selling any age restricted goods to young people, all stores moved to a Think 25 policy on Wednesday 15th July. The move to Think 25 has been supported with customer information posters, new training materials and new style point of sale advertising, plus a checkout prompt that is now being phased in. Colleagues are trained with this new policy in mind. However, in your situation as your husband had already purchased alcohol I think some common sense would be put in order and allow the sale. At Sainsbury’s we do aim to be a family orientated company, who have strong values. I’m again sorry for this experience. Jennifer ****************** https://www2.sainsburys.co.uk/YourIdeas/forums/15328/ShowThread.aspx#15328 HAPPYK23: I was at sainsbury with my wife and casher ask me to ID to buy a 4cans of guiness I showed ID then she says ok but ask my wife's ID (i am 26 and wife is 27) I don't understand her behaviour because if some dad or mom with their child are they cannot buy beer or bottle of wine ?? I understand your policy to ask ID but this is really not a good Idea under sainsbury policy parents with child or age over 25 with younger brother cannot buy drinks at all !!! i just curious if the case is like above what would you do nomally?? i want to here your policy I really disappointed with casher's behabiour even if i showed my ID she ask to my wife's ID funny thing is cahier and i had long conversation then she sell the beer I decide to not to go sainsbury ever again Finally i suggest sainsbury working team that judging age is very diffcult therefore if someone want buy beer you should ask ID no matter what age look like, just ask ID if someone want to buy it because i feel discimination from the chashier even if i showed ID CHEEKYMONKEY1990: Hi happyk23, I'm a Customer Services Team Leader at my local store, so I'll try and help with your problem. I'm really sorry if you feel disappointed by your recent experience in a Sainsbury’s store. Sainsbury’s is a responsible retailer, and as such has agreed to Think 25 when selling any age-restricted products, including alcohol. In effect, this means that we train our cashiers to ask for ID from anyone who they think could be aged under 25, and to refuse the sale if the customer cannot prove their age or the cashier suspects that the customer is buying the item on behalf of someone else under 18. The legal age for the purchase of alcohol has not changed, it is still 18. Age, as you rightly say, is a very difficult thing to judge for any cashier. As you say you are 26, and your wife 27, so the cashier who served you would be correct in thinking you were around the age of 25. That is why you have been asked for ID when buying alcohol. You suggested that Sainsbury's should adopt a policy of ID'ing anyone who was attempting to purchase alcohol, regardless of their age. I, personally, don't think it is necessary to ID a very elderly looking customer (because they are obviously over 18). However, the age “25” is more a psychological limit than a legal limit. We tell cashiers to think 25, because everyone has a different interpretation of what a 25 year old person looks like, and indeed there may be people who are 25 who look very young or very old for their age. However, cashiers who are caught selling alcohol to minors are breaking the law and face fines and possibe disciplinary action. So the policy is in place to protect the store, and our cashiers. It is not designed to annoy our customers. However, we never want to embarrass or inconvenience our customers, so I am sorry if you feel let-down on this occasion. Perhaps you might like to talk to a member of the Store Management if this happens to you again, and the issue can be investigated immediately. I hope this helps to clear up the situation, and I hope to see you in one of our Sainsbury's stores again shortly. James - Sainsbury's Bury St. Edmunds XIONG: Dear Sainsbury's, I'm afraid you have not actually clarified your reason for 'ID'ing those who accompany customers who have proven their age to be over 18. You mention that it would be an offense to sell alcohol to a minor, but this would not be the case if the customer has proof of age. The public is unanimous in their agreement that the policy is badly damaging the reputation of Sainsbury's for the following reasons: For adults who are truly trying to buy alcohol on behalf of minors, it would take just one failed attempt before routinely asking the minors to stand outside the store for any future, successful purchases. The only people prevented from buying alcohol in this way are people exactly as described in the account of happyk23 (above), expecting make a purchase in full accordance with British law but who are prevented from doing so by the misguided discretion of a Sainsbury's staff member. I too have personally found that maintaining a conversation with a cashier when this has occurred will lead to a sale, despite previous refusal. My only conclusion is that the policy was a misguided response to the further misguided backlash against your Basics Lager range. The lack of consistency or logic, and outrage felt by your otherwise loyal customers leaves you with much explaining to do. I look forward to a response. Xiong LESLEY@SAINSBURYS Hi there We have to make sure that any alcohol bought from our stores is not going to be consumed by anybody underage. We operate a Think 25 policy and this means that anybody who looks under the age of 25 will have to show an approved form of ID before they are allowed to purchase alcohol. Colleagues can be personally prosecuted if they sell alcohol to a minor, or to somebody who then gives it to a minor. I know it can sometimes come across as over-zealous, but it’s really important that colleagues don’t risk alcohol being consumed by someone underage. Along with other major supermarkets, we felt that our previous policy wasn’t quite strong enough. We’ve therefore moved to a Think 25 policy, which is supported by the Government. As long as customers can show ID when asked, we’ll of course be very happy to serve them. I hope this helps. POLLYWIGGLE: Hi, In reply to Lesley@Sainsburys you do not 'have to make sure that any alcohol bought from our stores is not going to be consumed by anybody underage'. The law relating to alcohol states that anybody over the age of 5 can drink alcohol at home or on other private premises. As it is impossible for you to know where the alcohol is going to be consumed & by whom, you are simply assuming that anyone buying alcohol with a child/minor/someone who may or may not be under 25 in tow will immediately hand it over outside the store for consumption in a public place. If this is how you choose to interpret the rules then why sell alcohol to anybody as you have no knowledge of how any alcohol that leaves your store is going to be drunk, by whom or where. I recently experienced this discrimination when I shopped at Sainsburys with my 16 year old son. I chose to leave my shopping at the checkout & cross the road to a competitor where I bought identical products with no problem. I object to Sainsburys making an assumption & moral judgement on my character & I will not be shopping at a Sainsburys store again. On 14 May 2010 14:51, Satoshi Kose <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Dear Liz and all: > > I wonder if the young one have been given a letter of proxy to buy alcohol > on senior's behalf. > > In the older days in Japan, it was quite likely that younger children were > sent to buy alcohol on their parents' behalf.... > > Satoshi Kose > > > > On 2010/05/14 20:59, Liz Panton wrote: > >> Hi Ed, >> >> What a humiliating experience. A similar thing happened in Morrisons to >> two >> male friends of mine. One is over sixty and due to ill health sometimes >> has >> difficulty walking. The other, who was helping with his shopping, is not >> much older than your son and looks very young - until he takes off his >> beany >> hat and you see his receding hairline! He didn't think to take off his >> hat >> when they were refused the purchase of alcohol in similar circumstances to >> your own. >> > > ________________End of message________________ > > This Disability-Research Discussion list is managed by the Centre for > Disability Studies at the University of Leeds ( > www.leeds.ac.uk/disability-studies). > Enquiries about list administration should be sent to > [log in to unmask] > > Archives and tools are located at: > www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/disability-research.html > You can VIEW, POST, JOIN and LEAVE the list by logging in to this web page. > -- I raise money for Communication Matters with Everyclick.com Find out how you can help here: http://www.everyclick.com/lizpanton ________________End of message________________ This Disability-Research Discussion list is managed by the Centre for Disability Studies at the University of Leeds (www.leeds.ac.uk/disability-studies). Enquiries about list administration should be sent to [log in to unmask] Archives and tools are located at: www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/disability-research.html You can VIEW, POST, JOIN and LEAVE the list by logging in to this web page.