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medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture John, I'm catching up on my email, and found this a very interesting one, informative and helfpul for when I do wade in to this book. (I was just wondering what saints were of importance in Ely, for instance....; I gather Pfaff will help me on that). This is just a plea for you to give us a further verdict when you've read those last 200 pages. thanks, cecilia On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 12:48 PM, John Briggs <[log in to unmask]>wrote: > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > > I have now waded through (Pfaff's own words: p.xiv) nearly another 200 > pages (chapters 5-9) dealing with the various monastic orders (after an > introduction, the first 150 pages dealt with the Anglo-Saxon and immediate > post-Conquest Norman period.) This has been much harder going, as there is a > much more detailed commentary on the various liturgical manuscripts, > although still nothing in the way of history. Liturgical issues are not > explained: I am still baffled as to what is actually meant by the 'doubling' > of saints in the Litany (I can guess, but that isn't the point.) A waspish > commentary on modern scholars is conducted in the footnotes, often with > irrelevant biographical details. The unfortunate Archdale A. King is treated > somewhat harshly. Pfaff is an inveterate, if rather unlucky, bibliographer: > in the absence of an actual bibliography, no-one has spotted that he cited > two different editions of the same book. The hapless indexer has conflated > two wildly different E.M. Thompsons. As the general index is the only > practical entry point into the bibliography, it is distressing to find the > note: "Modern scholars mentioned in the text are included, as are those > named in the footnotes if there is analytical or qualitative comment as > distinct from mere bibliographical reference." There are some astonishing > lacunae in his bibliography: for example, he includes discussion of > Constance Berman's "The Cistercian Evolution", but not of Chrysogonus > Waddell's three volumes of editions of early Cistercian documents! > (Incidentally, reviewers have lamented that they did not engage with each > other's work. Berman has responded that she shared her work with Waddell; he > did not share his with her.) > > It has belatedly dawned on me what Pfaff is really doing in his book. His > interest has always been in calendars and saints (his book of collected > essays was entitled "Liturgical calendars, saints and services in medieval > England" [Variorum, 1998]); as far as he is concerned entries for saints' > feasts in the calendar and sanctorale, together with the proper texts > employed, are the only aspects of the liturgy that anyone could possibly be > interested in! (Which might also explain why Sherry Reames, who has similar > interests, finds the book so valuable.) The entire book consists of a > commentary, arranged chronologically and thematically (secular by use, > monastic by order), on the surviving liturgical texts from medieval England, > discussing *only* that aspect of the various texts. > > To me, that is the tail wagging the dog. Correct me if I am wrong, but the > liturgy has three elements: words (texts: ordinary and proper), music, and > ceremonial (what action is performed, and who performs it.) It covers all > services (mass and office, and occasional services both priestly and > pontifical) throughout the day, and throughout the liturgical year > (temporale and sanctorale.) Yes, the inclusion of particular feasts and > their relative status is an important aspect of what makes individual > liturgies distinctive (although distinguishing individual Uses by focussing > on those features has not proved in practice either particularly easy or > particularly fruitful.) But it is the liturgy considered as a totality that > is important, not just that particular aspect. Pfaff, by contrast, regards > the English Premonstratensians as having a different liturgy from their > Continental colleagues simply because they include different saints in their > calendar (p.303)! > > I have another 250 pages (and 5 chapters) on the secular Uses to go - I may > then be in a position to give a final verdict. > > John Briggs > > ********************************************************************** > To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME > to: [log in to unmask] > To send a message to the list, address it to: > [log in to unmask] > To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion > to: [log in to unmask] > In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: > [log in to unmask] > For further information, visit our web site: > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html > ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask] For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html