It’s not about speaking for others. I am saying you nee
It’s not about speaking for others. I am saying you need
allies for your movement to be successful, that is, the more allies you have generally, and the more vocal they are,
the more accepted has your message become. Also, there is generally more
credibility given to a message against oppression when it is from a member of the oppressor group. It’s a different situation when members of
oppressed groups are discussing their particular experiences.
I am not restricting the point to academia. It applies as
much to mainstream literature and discourse – to take your example, if men are
speaking out against rape, or spousal abuse, or workplace discrimination, then
it means that part of the message of feminism has been successful.
Of course, there is always the concern about cooptation.
--- On Fri, 17/7/09, Emma Rowlett <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
From: Emma Rowlett <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FW: Re: FW: Re: DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009 (#2009-165)
To: [log in to unmask]
Date: Friday, 17 July, 2009, 5:11 PM
Jenny,
Does that mean you feel that feminism is seen as less credible than it
could have been because most feminist writers are women? Feminism
would not have existed unless women started talking and writing about
their experiences of oppression, and I think in general feminists are
not dismissed simply because they are female. So why should disabled
people be dismissed for writing about their experiences?
I think that while it may be true that for example, non-disabled
people writing about disability are seen as more credible than
disabled people writing about their experiences, but I feel that this
is a very sorry state of affairs. Obviously anyone writing solely
about their own experiences can only provide a limited perspective,
but I don't see why a person can't write about their experiences and
similar experiences of others without having to have someone who
hasn't shared these experiences speaking for them.
I'm glad that in my particular experience my own disabilities are seen
as providing valuable insight into my research into disability, and if
it ever starts becoming otherwise I'll have to seriously consider
other work!
Emma
On 17/07/2009, Jenny W <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> I am asking whether there is a formula/percentage to
> determin
>
>
>
>
> I am asking whether there is a formula/percentage to
> determine acceptable representation by disabled people?
>
>
>
> I myself am less concerned with etiquette, and more
> concerned about the substance of the message/policy. I agree about the need for
> representation from oppressed groups, and preferably that the oppressed group
> is directing the movement, but if the messenger/message/policy is inadequate, I
> don’t see how that is going to improve things.
>
>
>
> I feel that it generally brings more credibility to the
> message when the messenger is not herself part of the oppressed group since it
> becomes more difficult to argue that the concerns being raised are a figment of
> the oppressed group’s imagination.
>
>
>
> --- On Fri, 17/7/09, Judith Stephenson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> From: Judith Stephenson <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: FW: Re: FW: Re: DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009 (#2009-165)
>
> To: [log in to unmask]
>
> Date: Friday, 17 July, 2009, 9:52 AM
>
> SUbject: Re: FW: Re: DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009 (#2009-165)
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Not sure what you mean there Jenny, 'disabled representation'. Do you mean in DPOs (disabled people's organisations)? Clearly DPOs are led and controlled by disabled people, i.e. have a legal and constitutional majority. But that wasn't my point really. I take personal issue with the word 'representation', i.e. one is set up to be a representative without any real accountability. Been there, done it!
> I was posting from a personal political perspective. Allies are fine but I do still find it rather disturbing if not unsuprising that 'influential' allies from the so called 'oppressor' group give a movement more credibility and are listened to than the individual disabled person. This to me sounds very much like the ruling bourgeoise ideology one of tolerance and ameliorating reforms. Yes, these may improve the lives of disabled people slightly but do nothing whatsoever to change the way society is constructed. It will just continue to be the same, same, same and disabled people will always be considered 'other' as opposed to 'normal' and we all know from the women's movement it will be us that will have to fit into the 'norm'. The very unpopular word, these days such as 'class' has some bearing on the issue. Some disabled leaders have become incorporated and clearly whilst speaking on behalf of disabled people, in terms of rights etc have become
> detached from the movement. If you are rich or indeed even moderately/comfortably off you still face disabling barriers but with money, as in everything, they are more likely to be overcome. The grassroots organisations that work with disabled people from all 'walks' of life work with many poor people that have very little access to education, benefits, housing least of all disability research. Many of them do not have a clue what the social model is. Do you think they are listened to?
> Influential allies can help in this but the grassroots needs to lead the way and academia needs to listen.
> People who have been discriminated against; have been subject to hate crime and or violence/abuse are still not often listened to. Perhaps this is because it so out of the realm/environment of some people's understanding because they are perhaps, white, non-disabled or straight and haven't encountered it themselves.
> I and my ex partner who is Black african were consistently harassed - graffiti on our house, windows smashed, car smashed with even my leaflets at work scrawled upon with racist expletives (I lived down the road from main office/dpo). This went on for five years with various inept police investigations. I keep quiet about it now because people, mainly white non-disabled people don't believe it because it hasn't happened to them. Sometimes they need almost a paradigm shift to do so.
> This is why in our case Disabled people should speak on behalf of themselves.
>
>
> Message Received: Jul 17 2009, 01:15 AM
>
> From: "Jenny W"
>
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Cc:
>
> Subject: Re: FW: Re: DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009 (#2009-165)
>
>
>
>
> Agree with Claudia. The work is more important than the messenger.
>
> P.S. Colin seems to be arguing that having members of oppressor group speak out is a bad thing. In fact, it generally gives more credibility to the message. Colin's social movement examples were successful precisely because of the many privileged allies who spoke up.
>
> Judith - what percentage of disabled representation are you hoping for (e.g., 55-45, 60-40, 80-20) ??
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On Wed, 15/7/09, Judith Stephenson wrote:
>
>
> From: Judith Stephenson
>
> Subject: FW: Re: DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009 (#2009-165)
>
> To: [log in to unmask]
>
> Date: Wednesday, 15 July, 2009, 8:39 AM
>
>
>
>
> Subject: Re: DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009 (#2009-165)
>
>
> Call it 'essentialism'. Interesting term. Perhaps non-disabled people should do a 'Bob Connell' and give themselves an impairment if they feel so strongly about the systematic oppression that we face as Disabled people in our everyday lives. I jest, of course but the point is Men do speak on behalf of women, white people do speak on behalf of Black and minority ethnic people and so forth. This is not to say that those individuals do not identify with groups of people who are seemingly oppressed by those that hold the power but as Colin says - it should be disabled people first and foremost that speak on their own behalf until we have some semblance of equality.
> 'Disability scholarship' is an interesting phrase as well. Yes, of course academia and the study of disability may further the social movement but it is disabled people themselves that should be challenging and revolutionising the social construct that notwithstanding disability scholarship, legislation, direct payments is not suited to the human being and in particular the human being with impairment.
>
>
>
>
> ========================================
> Message Received: Jul 15 2009, 12:58 AM
> From: "Malacrida, Claudia"
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Cc:
> Subject: Re: DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009 (#2009-165)
>
>
> I'm not so sure that essentialism is the answer. Bob Connell was a very
> articulate and positive critic of gender and power and although a man,
> was well-accepted as a member of the women's movement and seen as a
> strong contributor to women's studies. I think one of the strengths of
> having Bob Connell 'on-side' was that he was seen by hostile outsiders
> as a person who didn't have a personal 'agenda' because he was not a
> woman. In fact, I have heard from some essentialist women that, now that
> Connell has transitioned to being a woman and goes by the name Raewyn
> Connell, that her position as a disinterested profeminist scholar has
> actually been undermined! And of course, there are also feminists who
> feel that Raewyn isn't a 'real' woman because she wasn't born one, and
> so she's disqualified on that score as well. Seems you can't win
> sometimes.
>
> I'd say the same thing goes for disability scholarship - if we're going
> to say that someone has to have a disability in order to
> speak/write/advocate, then perhaps the next step will be that they need
> to have visible disabilities, or that they have to have been born with a
> disability rather than acquiring it, or it has to be physical rather
> than sensory, or some other ratcheting up of policing the body. I wonder
> if it isn't more important to evaluate what people have to say in terms
> of their ethics and the usefulness of their work for the greater social
> movement than it is to assess their credentials on a scale of whether,
> or how profoundly, they are disabled/gendered, etc.
>
> Best wishes,
> Claudia Malacrida
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: The Disability-Research Discussion List
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
> DISABILITY-RESEARCH automatic digest system
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 5:05 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009
> (#2009-165)
>
> There is 1 message totalling 61 lines in this issue.
>
> Topics of the day:
>
> 1. Would you expect a 'white' person to represent the voices of BME
> community
> , so.....
>
> ________________End of message________________
>
> This Disability-Research Discussion list is managed by the Centre for
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> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 18:43:56 +0100
> From: Colin REvell
> Subject: Would you expect a 'white' person to represent the voices of
> BME community , so.....
>
> Would you expect a 'white' person to represent the voices of BME
> community =
> and 'speak-out' their basic human and civil rights struggles?
> =20
> Would you expect a 'hetrosexual' person to represent the voices of LGBT
> com=
> munity and 'speak-out' their basic human and civil rights struggles?
> =20
> Would you expect a 'men' to represent 'womens' voices and 'speak-out'
> their=
> basic human and civil rights struggles?.....
> =20
> ...so for god sake why are well still allowing non-disabled people
> (includi=
> ng professionals) to control and represent the voices of the Disabled
> commu=
> nity and 'speak-out' our basic human and civil rights struggles=2C under
> 'N=
> othing About Us=2C Without Us'... times really need to change within
> attitu=
> des and behaviour =2C including politically too=2C to understand
> 'inclusion=
> ' what it means to Disabled People.
> =20
> Disabled People=2C like other minority groups need allies=2C but their
> need=
> s to be time for reflection of what people think 'Becoming An Ally'
> really =
> means in practice.... Some people need to be taught how to let go of
> their =
> 'power'
> =20
> How To Be An Ally?
> Food for thought: ?Becoming an ally to oppressed people.
> Excerpt from =93Becoming an Ally Breaking the Cycle of Oppression=94 by
> Ann=
> e Bishop.
> Published by Fernwood Publishing=2C Halifax
> =20
> "How To"- Becoming an Ally
> http://www.daa.org.uk/index.php?page=3Dhow-to-be-an-ally
>
> Colin Revell
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
>
> MSN straight to your mobile - news=2C entertainment=2C videos and more.
>
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>
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> ------------------------------
>
> End of DISABILITY-RESEARCH Digest - 13 Jul 2009 to 14 Jul 2009
> (#2009-165)
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--
Emma Jane Rowlett (née Wright)
School of Sociology and Social Policy
University of Nottingham
[log in to unmask]
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