I am connected with Transition Town Brixton as well, but we rely upon thinking people such as subscribe to this forum for guidance, rather than being able to come to better informed conclusions ourselves.
I agree with Christopher Shaw and Jonathan Ward that offsetting may be occasionally necessary for real emergencies, for individuals to decide by searching their consciences, but our basic positon should be: no way! The necessity of reducing global carbon concentrations way below the present, 381 > 350 ppm, is far too serious for tinkering at the edges with offsetting practices.
Cheers from Jim Scott
Visit: http//:www.save-our-world.net (global) and www.save-our-world.org.uk
Registered charity no. 1111210 in England & Wales
Please note new e-mail address [log in to unmask]
----- Original Message -----
From: Tom Barker
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 12:50 PM
Subject: Re: Carbon Balanced by the World Land Trust. Offset your carbon dioxide emissions
Gosh, I really hate to promote my own publication and everything, but a group of us in Cheshire produced a sustainability guide in March for the new unitary authority, so they could embark upon a sustainability drive. it was immediately adopted by the new council and has been cut-and-pasted by other authorities. Apparently it ticks a box on their obligations to central government, so Councils find it easy to adopt. Doing that commits them to support local groups who want to do exactly what we're talking about. I'll attach it. Please get your local council to adopt it. It's made to do that job, is copyright-free etc. So delete the bits related to Cheshire, add in some more relevant to your area, add your name to the author list, and present it to the Councillors in your Local Authority who are interested in sustainability issues. For anyone who wants it, a Word version can be obtained from me.
Cheers, Tom
PS. and Jonathan, your text was not too long, or boring. That is the reality. I haven't seen some friends for years. The Global Village if for people who haven't thought hard enough yet.
At 12:24 12/06/2009, Kelly-Gerreyn B.A. wrote:
I have found that the Transition Town movement provides the umbrella basis under which many of the issues raised here can be taken forward. We are in the process of setting up Transition Southampton and the recent annual Transition conference in London was very inspiring in the face of much to do. And the word is spreading very fast indeed.
Boris
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From: Discussion list for the Crisis Forum [ mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wright, Steve
Sent: Friday June 2009 12:09
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Carbon Balanced by the World Land Trust. Offset your carbon dioxide emissions
Personally I feel wary of offsetts since it would be run by the same Iskras who brought us the derivatives crisis and it smells a bit like papal indulgences from another era with the same rank ethics.
It would be good if we had further derative solutions based on carrots as well as sticks that yielded a percentage drop in emmissions with personal gain rather than pain. Perhaps economists could tell us how much would be saved in C02 emmissions if we all gave up meat and ate collectively a few days a month - I suspect more than some of the transport options.
If we had joined up thinking - taking Tom's point - would it not be great if we had national schemes to grow fruit trees for example - it would take five a day to a new level if it was simply growing in our schools, workplaces and parks.
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Discussion list for the Crisis Forum [ mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Tom Barker
Sent: 12 June 2009 09:40
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Carbon Balanced by the World Land Trust. Offset your carbon dioxide emissions
One consideration may be that the atmospheric carbon balance is so disrupted now (with the 40-year time lag of course), that we need to stop flying, reduce our use of carbon fuels drastically, AND plant as many trees as possible. Even if we offset all of the carbon fuels burnt in flying, driving, heating etc., we would then only be treading water. We need to capture atmospheric carbon as well as stop putting it into the atmosphere.
Tom
At 09:04 12/06/2009, Willott, John wrote:
I share many of the concerns about C offsets, and saw some of the practical issues while doing some work with one scheme to replant rainforest a few years ago.
However, I would be interested in what forumers do or advocate then? Obviously not flying and reducing C dependency is the best solution, but assuming many or most of us still do fly or use other long distance travel now and then, what do you do? Not purchase offsets at all?
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Discussion list for the Crisis Forum [ mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of A&M Meikle
Sent: 09 June 2009 10:18
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Carbon Balanced by the World Land Trust. Offset your carbon dioxide emissions
Yes, it looks good on the surface but if we're not reducing energy demand and the use of fossil fuels, we won't make the changes needed. No one can argue against conserving endangered habitats but the inherent problems of commodifying & trading pollution shouldn't be overlooked.
There's also the worry that pollution could increase because people think the offset part is good & won't be funded otherwise. I'm thinking of the case of fees for late pick-up of children from schools (in US?). Rather than incentivising parents to be on time, the fee made them think that they were paying for this additional childcare service and late pick-ups actually increased!
Here's another example I discovered recently: "By driving, you will be saving the planet. And the more you drive, the more you prevent catastrophic climate change." Biopact (which runs the Biochar Fund) on negative emissions energyþ
(Ref: http://news.mongabay.com/bioenergy/2007/10/strange-world-of-carbon-negative.html )
Unbelievable! Attitudes like this lead me to be highly sceptical about off-set but if the off-set was a real reduction in energy demand (i.e. reduce the source of emissions) rather than sink creation (e.g. tree planting) then it may stand more chance of working.
Mandy
----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Keene
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Monday, June 08, 2009 10:24 PM
Subject: Carbon Balanced by the World Land Trust. Offset your carbon dioxide emissions
http://www.carbonbalanced.org/?gclid=CIXq8LHN-5oCFaAA4wodWT6BdQ
What does everyone think of this?
Chris
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Tom Barker BSc, PhD
SWIMMER (Institute for Sustainable Water, Integrated Management, and Ecosystem Research)
Nicholson Building
University of Liverpool
Liverpool
L69 3GP
0151 795 4646
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Support Contraction and Convergence - the global response to climate change
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Download a model for the local response: http://www.chester.gov.uk/pdf/Vision2050.pdf
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Tom Barker BSc, PhD
SWIMMER (Institute for Sustainable Water, Integrated Management, and Ecosystem Research)
Nicholson Building
University of Liverpool
Liverpool
L69 3GP
0151 795 4646
[log in to unmask]
Support Contraction and Convergence - the global response to climate change
http://www.gci.org.uk/briefings/ICE.pdf
Download a model for the local response: http://www.chester.gov.uk/pdf/Vision2050.pdf
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