"In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak
up because I wasn't a Communist;
And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn't speak up
because I wasn't a trade unionist;
And then they came for the Jews, And I didn't speak up because I
wasn't a Jew;
And then . . . they came for me . . . And by that time there was no
one left to speak up."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came...
I am the son of a refugee from Hitler's Austria (then Germany). I do
not think you are being unduly alarmist.
Phil Ogden wrote:
>
> I rarely stick my head above the parapet nowadays as my DP role has
> diminished.
>
> I do so now because if "they" are making a list of names of the
> dissenters and connecting people who know people then I want in too
> (yes, I joined the "send all your emails to Jacqui Smith" day campaign
> on Facebook for just the same reason).
>
> I do, however, have a serious contribution referring to something Tim
> touched upon with the "Nothing to Hide" brigade.
>
> Nazi Germany - I can think of around six million people who thought
> they had nothing to hide, then times changed and they probably wished
> their ethnicity was a little less of a matter of public record.
> Previously witches were burned at the stake, this is no longer regular
> practice (apart from some remote parts of Africa) but who knows if
> sanity will prevail (history shows us otherwise).
>
> Times change, and what's recorded cannot be un-recorded. In addition
> these "intelligence" systems rely on heresay and rumour, ephemeral
> connections that may have been totally innocent at the time, things
> done and said whilst blind drunk (the internet should have a
> breathalyser fitted as standard!), or even things done by other people
> in our name - we are not talking about burden of proof here, what's
> being stored isn't verified as actually being correct in content or
> attribution.
>
> It just strikes me as desperately foolish to take the "nothing to
> hide" view - or am I being overly paranoid?
>
> </end second rant!>
>
> Phil Ogden.
>
> Information & Research Officer
> Neighbourhood Services
> Leeds City Council
>
> Tel: 0113 24 75630
> Fax: 0113 24 75978
>
> Address:
> Environment and Neighbourhoods Regeneration Service
> 6th Floor West, Merrion House, 110 Merrion Centre, LEEDS LS2 8BB
>
> http://www.leeds.gov.uk
>
>
>
> *Tim Trent <[log in to unmask]>*
> Sent by: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
> <[log in to unmask]>
>
> 25/03/2009 08:19
> Please respond to
> Tim Trent <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
>
> To
> [log in to unmask]
> cc
>
> Subject
> Re: Social Networking Sites - More Big Brother?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [rant]
> I wonder if there is some sort of correlation here. The nations with
> the most stringent data protection and privacy regulations in the
> early days seemed to be those with a history of totalitarianism,
> surveillance and intrusion(!) into individual privacy.
>
> Hungary was a Safe Haven, for example. France, invaded by Nazi
> Germany is against whistle blowers. Spain has draconian penalties.
>
> And here we have the UK under Brown's New Labour, showing all the
> enthusiasms of Wilson et al for regulation and gathering of little
> bits of control and information.
>
> And the "Them with nowt to hide has nowt to fear" reactions of the
> Daily Mail reader are in tune with this.
>
> Whatever the popular press and knee jerk government may say, the world
> is no more full of terrorists now that it was of anarchists in 1914 in
> Sarajevo. They just want to control us. And we, the people who have
> delegated power to out elected representatives, put up with all this
> surveillance in order to save a couple of lives which could never have
> been saved anyway.
>
> Terrorists look like you and like me. They look normal until the
> moment them commit their acts.
>
> Of course Ibrahim, you and I are now connected. Your name is not
> classically Anglo Saxon, I'm the son of an immigrant, and you have
> expressed an interest over monitoring of terrorism in this manner.
> Shall we both, now, expect a knock on the door because iof this email
> exchange on a public list? Have we both committed yet another new
> crime of discussing terrorism while not not classically Anglo Saxon?
> [/rant]
>
> Ibrahim Hasan wrote:
>
> Social networking sites like Facebook could be monitored by the UK
> government under proposals to make them keep details of users'
> contacts.The Home Office said it was needed to tackle crime gangs and
> terrorists who might use the sites, but said it would not keep the
> content of conversations. Civil liberties campaigners have called the
> proposal a "snoopers' charter".
>
> _http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7962631.stm_
>
> Regards
>
> Ibrahim Hasan
>
> Solicitor and Trainer
> _www.informationlaw.org.uk_ <http://www.informationlaw.org.uk/>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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