Gerasimos
OK. Speak to you later. We can carry this on off-list. I'll get back to you when I've heard from the organisers in the Hague.
Rowdy Yates
Senior Research Fellow
Scottish Addiction Studies
Sociology, Social Policy & Criminology Section
Department of Applied Social Science
University of Stirling
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________________________________
From: Therapeutic Communities [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Gerasimos Papanastasatos
Sent: 28 January 2009 12:20
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [EFTC] Potential UK members
Of cource I can facillitate this workshop. Unfortunately I won't be in Lima for family reasons. Nevertheless a callborator of mine will try to mmet you there. Take care.
________________________________
From: Therapeutic Communities [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Rowdy Yates
Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2009 2:13 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [EFTC] Potential UK members
Gerasimos
Excellent idea. I'l mail the conference organisers and suggest that we would like some time for a workshop on the core standards. We can use the CoC standards as a starting point. Would you be prepared to facilitate it with me? We could discuss it next week at the WFTC conference.
Rowdy Yates
Senior Research Fellow
Scottish Addiction Studies
Sociology, Social Policy & Criminology Section
Department of Applied Social Science
University of Stirling
E: [log in to unmask]<BLOCKED::mailto:[log in to unmask]>
W: http://www.dass.stir.ac.uk/sections/showsection.php?id=4 (home)
http://www.drugslibrary.stir.ac.uk<http://www.drugslibrary.stir.ac.uk/> (library)
T: +44(0)1786 - 467737
M: 07894- 864897
________________________________
From: Therapeutic Communities [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Gerasimos Papanastasatos
Sent: 28 January 2009 11:58
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [EFTC] Potential UK members
It is a good idea Rowdy,
I thing there is time till June to conclude a broad discussion and to prepare a kind of presentation or an open workshop in occasion of the next EFTC Conference. The board of EFTC in The Hague could reach in a common agreement between the members.
Gerasimos
________________________________
From: Therapeutic Communities [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Rowdy Yates
Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2009 1:04 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [EFTC] Potential UK members
Richard et al
An interesting discussion this. I suspect that the same may be true in other European countries. For the UK ones, I suggest that I write as Vice-President of the EFTC attaching a copy of the standards and saying that we have noticed their designation in the directory and are wanting to encourage them to join since there are a number of agencies simply using the phrase as a convenience and that by being part of the EFTC they are in some measure protected against any backwash since the EFTC is a respected organisation which ensures that its members are genuinely using the recognised TC methodology.
How does that sound as a first step??
Rowdy Yates
Senior Research Fellow
Scottish Addiction Studies
Sociology, Social Policy & Criminology Section
Department of Applied Social Science
University of Stirling
E: [log in to unmask]<BLOCKED::mailto:[log in to unmask]>
W: http://www.dass.stir.ac.uk/sections/showsection.php?id=4 (home)
http://www.drugslibrary.stir.ac.uk<http://www.drugslibrary.stir.ac.uk/> (library)
T: +44(0)1786 - 467737
M: 07894- 864897
________________________________
From: Therapeutic Communities [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Richard Phillips
Sent: 28 January 2009 06:55
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [EFTC] Potential UK members
Hi Rex / all
Obviously one would need to be careful about how to approach the legal issues, but I do think this matters a great deal - certainly within my experience of the UK.
With all the challenges faced by Rehabs in general, TC's have a great strength and a great vulnerability. The vulnerability is that programme length tends to be longer, which given the effectiveness of short stay programmes for some clients makes it harder to carve out the expensive niche.
The great strength of the TC is that the evidence base is robust and holds up to scrutiny.
This strength become watered down when you have most houses which call themselves TC's using very little of the method. In one of the reviews (I think NTA sponsored, but independently run) of Rehabs in the UK, Therapeutic Communities fared poorly - but most of the houses were not TC's in the way you understand it. If I remember rightly, the published report didn't actually draw attention to this poor performance, as the authors understood the vagueness of the term and understood that this would cause misunderstanding.
In general, addiction TCs in the UK don't have a terrific reputation. I think this a combination of out of date perceptions of concept house, a lack of understanding of the evidence base and finally that the term means whatever you want it to mean.
I didn't know the term was a registered trademark - personally I think this is huge news. At the CofC I always felt we should be more proactive in shaping perceptions of the TC brand, the fact that the term has legal standing makes this much easier:
My back of an envelope suggestion would be:
1. To formally decide that the definition of an addictions TC is one that meets the core standards.
2. Then, begin to quietly promote this notion to all houses that call themselves addictions TCs and educate them on the evidence base. Try and convince some of the pseudo's them to become 'true' TCs
3. Also promote the brand directly to commissioners, with a gentle education campaign - produce a fact sheet with the evidence base and core standards.
4. Down the road, request those not meeting the core standards to stop calling themselves TCs.
5. Further down the road still, require them to not use the term.
In my view, the future of addictions TCs is to be the dominant force in the niche market of longer stay rehab. This will only be possible if the brand has some meaning, which is currently hard to claim - at least in the UK.
The aim should be to reclaim the brand and give it value.
Oh, and I would suggest there is huge merit in getting this well underway before a change of government.
I am hoping to attend Sarah's CofC event - I would be happy to prepare a short discussion paper or something on these ideas if it is of interest.
Can I check - do you have / registered for international trademarks?
Many regards
Richard
----------------------------
Richard Phillips
----------------------------
2009/1/27 Rex Haigh <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>>
Interesting...
In CofC and ATC I'm proposing that the relevant organisations get together and claim 'Therapeuetic Community' as a trademark in UK (maybe elsewhere later).
So if scruffy non-TC places used it the organisations could legally challenge it. (Italian MH TCs would love to be able to distinguish themselves from any-old residential care homes)
Will needs lots of work, particularly herding the cats.
May not be worth it, but probably worth talking about it.
See www.ipo.gov.uk<http://www.ipo.gov.uk>
Rex
From: Therapeutic Communities [mailto:[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>] On Behalf Of Richard Phillips
Sent: 27 January 2009 17:29
To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [EFTC] Potential UK members
Rowdy said:
>> a number of these services describe themselves as TCs
Unfortunately, in many cases this is the only thing they have in common with TC's
This is a big issue for addictions TC's that they are hard for purchasers and clients to distinguish from those that use the label but know or care little of the TC method. In my view, the Community of Communities project should seek to reclaim the name through the standards work and push for the term to have meaning..
perhaps an issue for discussion at the CofC day? you know it is a hobbyhorse of mine Rowdy!
Regards
----------------------------
Richard Phillips
----------------------------
2009/1/27 Rowdy Yates <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>>
The latest issue of Drink and Drugs News - a free UK trade journal - includes a directory of UK residential services. (It also includes an interesting article on the barriers to residential treatment in the UK.
You can download a PDF copy of the magazine (including the directory) here:
http://www.drinkanddrugsnews.com/magazine/9bc447645d9a4d55b7563573039ccf52.pdf
By the way - EFTC members please note - a number of these services describe themselves as TCs so as part of the EFTC 2009 campaign to increase membership, I will be writing to them asking them to join the Federation!
Rowdy Yates
Senior Research Fellow
Scottish Addiction Studies
Sociology, Social Policy & Criminology Section
Department of Applied Social Science
University of Stirling
E: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
W: http://www.dass.stir.ac.uk/sections/showsection.php?id=4 (home)
http://www.drugslibrary.stir.ac.uk<http://www.drugslibrary.stir.ac.uk/> (library)
T: +44(0)1786 - 467737
M: 07894- 864897
________________________________
Academic Excellence at the Heart of Scotland.
The University of Stirling is a charity registered in Scotland, number SC 011159.
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The University of Stirling is a charity registered in Scotland, number SC 011159.
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Academic Excellence at the Heart of Scotland.
The University of Stirling is a charity registered in Scotland,
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