Re: Whatever happened toDear Peter, Mairead, Ian, Tim and all
Of course, you're all right! Mairead makes excellent points about the proliferation of real acivity in the US. Even in the UK money is going into 'live literature' and 'performance poetry,' which I applaud. However, the small ground for more experimental poetry in the UK, it seems to me, has been shortened.
I'd argue that those working in 'edge' poetry have largely turned to art and film in the UK (my subscription to the Artists' Newsletter - AN - is far more important to me than my subscription to the National Poetry Society). I think this is because the visual arts scene (including film) in the UK maintains a contradictory take on art through the art school system where notions of conceptualism versus craftsmanship are played out on a daily basis. This would be exciting if the intellectual debate between conceptualism and craftsmanship was also played out on a daily basis. It isn't.
Viewing masses of students' work via the arts factory, Norwich, the tedium of in-jokes, the immediate, the slight, the strand of a tradition purveyed by a tutor, means the work falls to pieces too quickly. I see myself looking at FaceBook - not online but in the work.
I'm sure you all have a FaceBook page like I but it is utterly the opposite of what it pretends to be: for 'friends' it is a competition to gather more & more friends as points in a tiny & impossible celeb competition; and for the FaceBook company it is the means to sell on the details of participants.
I argue that a subscribers' list like this List have never been more important. If we feel that the internet has to be a real international tool for artists and poets, what is or has been a tool? Blogs certainly, YouTube probably. MySpace and FaceBook just atomize human beings - make them falsely compete.
Yes, there can be an exchange of information via these interfaces but there is no discussion and no debate! And if you've looked at 'poetry' on MySpace, no poetry.
I'm glad I had a 'shout.' David Swords wrote a poem here - and I got a strand going!
Love, Rupert
www.mallin.blogspot.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Riley
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2008 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to
This list is in fact less dead than UKPoetry, and PoetryEtc is in its own way entirely gone-to-rest or out-to-lunch.
Ian is probably right in saying that things like Facebook are responsible, or blogs in general, the refreshing possibility of talking with *friends*...
Or is it simply because most people have given up the attempt ?
PR
From: ian davidson <[log in to unmask]>
Reply-To: ian davidson <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2008 15:04:42 +0000
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to
Hi Tim,
Bit unfair on Mairead, who I think has done and continues to do a really good job, and brings a really interesting perspective to the list.
Just went back through the archives and the following have been discussed this year.
January extended discussion of 20th Century Long Poems, Coleridge, Love Poems,
February long discussion of british and irish poetry, longer discussion on divisions, camps and spectrums, more on love poems,
April extended discussion of Laura Riding, Neologism etc
All seems useful to me, and relevant to the interests of the list. I'd also say one of the legitimate uses of the list is to inform members of events, publications etc. There are quiet spells of course.
It is probably true that if we look back to the late 90s then that was a golden age of listservs, but that was before facebook, my space etc, and a million other ways to communicate. I don't think these lists will ever have the impact they made then, when they linked people that geography had held apart, but they still serve an important purpose, for discussion and distribution of information.
best
Ian
> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2008 14:06:35 +0100
> From: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Whatever happened to
> To: [log in to unmask]
>
> 'Whatever happened to the heroes / all those Shakespeareoes'
>
> Testing testing. Looking for listserve that caters for the interests
> of British and Irish innovative poets etc. Can't find it. Used to be
> on something called British-Irish poets with interesting people
> talking about interesting things (sometimes at least) until its
> management was taken over by two people who did not fully understand
> or appreciate the interests and inclination of many of its most
> faithful members.
>
> Testing testing.
>
> Tim A.
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