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Glad you're not into 'Diry Washing' ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Vincent" <[log in to unmask]> To: <[log in to unmask]> Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2007 11:08 PM Subject: Re: Joe Green >I go with Mark here. No offense to folks who found/find Joe Green >interesting for whatever reasons, I found my intial responses from him to >be offensive. I saw no need to make an issue, and just went with the delete >button. I am disappointed to have to have done that. It took something away >from the experience here which had begun to look more like 'Greenland.' >Clearly something serious b/c must have happened and parties were unable >to reconcile. I am not at all interested in the diry wash. The list has >given Anny the power to exercise removals, and I am not going to argue. If >some folks want to leave, there are many other places to go. > > I know lists go in whorls - from one kind of poverty to another, and then > 'whoosh' good stuff comes down the pipe and gets everyone into a good > churn. And we have definitely had those here, many times,over the years > that I have been a member and frequent participant. > > With a few exceptions it's been awhile since I felt any 'churn' here. I > look forward to the change. > > Stephen Vincent > http://stephenvincent.net/blog/ > > Mark Weiss <[log in to unmask]> wrote: I have no idea what's going on, > though I tend to trust Anny. > > As a point of information, Kasper, you have no more idea than I do > what the majority feel about this or anything else, as maybe a dozen > folks actually say anything on the list. I've personally found Joe's > work so boring that I've taken to deleting it unread, which is > neither support for his dismissal nor retention. > > As to what happens b/c, there's a history on this list of really > nasty stuff, far nastier than the material that surfaced on the list. > Harassment of members or listowners backchannel has been grounds for > removal for a long time. > > But I don't know the specifics here. > > Mark > > At 05:28 PM 12/18/2007, you wrote: >>whatsmore, I thought this was all done with the last time some >>malcontents lambasted JG and were put in their place. jesus! do people >>WANT this list to be insular & homogenic? >> >>KS >> >>On 19/12/2007, kasper salonen wrote: >> > if Joe Green isn't reinstated into PoetryEtc, I'm considering leaving >> > the list. not intended as dramatic, just a decision of principle. >> > >> > in addition to the 'b/c - List' breach that Rupert brings up, I >> > consider it a shame bordering on idiocy to remove as unique & >> > productive a member as JG from a list gasping, in my opinion, for some >> > texture & moisture just because his texture was too rough for SOME, >> > not ALL or even a majority, list members' tastes and just because his >> > moisture was too moist for the underarms & foreheads of same SOME, not >> > ALL or even a majority of, list members. >> > >> > in my opinion PoetryEtc would better be served by adapting to >> > unpredictable, diverse & extremely creative behaviour like Joe Green's >> > -- rather than suppressing it in favour of academic discourse. you >> > asked, "Why don't members read and share what is interesting and >> > published online, for example?" well, Joe rather wrote his own. on my >> > own behalf I can say that Joe Green has made me more open and aware of >> > narration & rhythm & (sure, sometimes pompous but mostly impeccable) >> > comedy in poetry. I would consider it an honour to be 'ATTACKED' by >> > him. >> > >> > this needs to be rethought very carefully, mgrs. >> > >> > KS >> > >> > On 18/12/2007, Anny Ballardini wrote: >> > > Joe Green has been removed from the POETRYETC list. Notification has >> > > been >> > > sent. >> > > >> > > I do not think I have to justify the present decision. As I said in >> > > my >> > > previous mail, several members b/c-ed asking for the removal of >> Joe Green. >> > > Since the question was held b/c I will not mention the names of the >> > > said >> > > contributors. >> > > >> > > As I also said, the decision is not mine because I do not like >> to have the >> > > power of death or of life on people, especially if they are adults. >> > > >> > > As the co-manager of this list, I highly praise contributions based >> > > on >> > > poetry, reviews, links related to poetry and discussions on poetry. >> > > It is >> > > true that this is Poetryetc which means there is an ETC, but it >> is also true >> > > that the root, the leading word is POETRY. >> > > >> > > On the other hand, and I am suggesting, could not this ETC be >> arts, Arts in >> > > general, movies, videos, music, visual art, digital art, any kind of >> > > Art. >> > > Are there any other topics the members would like to discuss in a >> > > constructive way? As poets I think that we want to improve, why >> not make of >> > > this space an important reference for all? >> > > >> > > I had to update my resume this morning and realized _once again_ the >> > > enormous amount of poetry published out there. Why don't members read >> > > and >> > > share what is interesting and published online, for example? I >> bumped into >> > > Jacket, Black Box, The Argotist Online, Big Bridge, University sites, >> > > Publications, there is so much that I feel dizzy. >> > > >> > > I hope I will have an interesting feedback and I also remind >> everyone that >> > > as a rule once a member is not on the list please avoid any comments. >> > > >> > > With my best wishes, serving Poetryetc, >> > > >> > > Anny Ballardini >> > > co-manager >> > > >> >