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I'd put it rather differently. The benefits system tries to impose a particular view of household structure where a couple has one head of household who either works or receives benefits. However, in the great majority of couple households not claiming benefits both partners work and have their own incomes. The combination of the benefit system trying to protect children in lone parent households and to impose an outdated conception of income under the control of the head of household in couple households is that women in workless couple households reject financial subjection to their partners through the benefits system and claim as lone parents separately. The logical concomitant of this is that the male partner is, if they want to have their own income and not be dependent on the female partner (a choice some make as well as participation in the shadow economy), they have to have an address at which to receive benefits which passes government checks for obvious fraud. In the census context, both groups of males (those effectively dependents of their female partner and not claiming) and those claiming independently, would want to be invisible. Equally, many such males will be invisible to administrative databases such as health registrations with GPs, tax, especially if shadow economy participants, but may be visible to benefit databases at incorrect addresses. Voter registration in such circumstances is unlikely. --------------------------------------------------------- Paul Bivand Head of Analysis and Statistics Direct Line: 020 7840 8335 Inclusion 3rd floor, 89 Albert Embankment, London SE1 7TP Tel: 020 7582 7221 Fax: 020 7582 6391 Inclusion website: www.cesi.org.uk The contents of this e-mail and any attachment(s) are intended solely for the use of the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient please return the e-mail to the sender and delete from your mailbox. The contents of this e-mail and any attachment(s) are intended solely for the use of the addressee. -----Original Message----- From: email list for Radical Statistics [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Martin Rathfelder Sent: 07 November 2007 21:28 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Benefit drop address The social security system rewards people for living apart. So often one partner has an address where they pretend to live and where the benefit payments arrive. They really live somewhere else with their partner. Both partners may be reluctant to respond honestly to census enumerators. I am available for cultural awareness tours of the seedier parts of Manchester if any statisticians need them. A small administrative charge may be made. Martin Rathfelder Director Socialist Health Association 22 Blair Road Manchester M16 8NS 0870 013 0065 www.sochealth.co.uk If you do not wish to be on our mailing list please let us know and we will remove you. R.Thomas wrote: > "benefit drop address" > > Please explain! > > Ray Thomas > ************************* > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: email list for Radical Statistics > [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Paul Bivand > Sent: 07 November 2007 18:30 > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: More about Lockheed Martin and the census > [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED] > > > Giving people a cash incentive usually helps - but in context one would need to do that in the parallel census coverage survey. You need to ensure that it isn't taken off their benefits though. Equally if you are in a flat interviewing a lone parent and the father of her children is present you need to take his details too - including an address (usually known as a benefit drop address). Some 100 years later that'll become evident (at least it did in the old enumerators' books). > > Sometimes a lottery type incentive works - either handing out scratchcards or putting names of those who return forms in a raffle for a reasonably decent consumer durable, with a rather better than lottery chance of winning. > > --------------------------------------------------------- > Paul Bivand > Head of Analysis and Statistics > Direct Line: 020 7840 8335 > > Inclusion > 3rd floor, 89 Albert Embankment, London SE1 7TP > Tel: 020 7582 7221 > Fax: 020 7582 6391 > Inclusion website: www.cesi.org.uk > > > ****************************************************** Please note that if you press the 'Reply' button your message will go only to the sender of this message. 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If you want to reply to the whole list, use your mailer's 'Reply-to-All' button to send your message automatically to [log in to unmask] Disclaimer: The messages sent to this list are the views of the sender and cannot be assumed to be representative of the range of views held by subscribers to the Radical Statistics Group. To find out more about Radical Statistics and its aims and activities and read current and past issues of our newsletter you are invited to visit our web site www.radstats.org.uk. *******************************************************