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That should be "intriguing ... Fasciculus Morum." -- jcn On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 14:11:01 -0400 "James C. Nohrnberg" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > All of this (on the grene path to lyfe": in E.K. on "November") is very >intirguing, and perhaps conventionally so, in the light of the Fasculus >Morum, V.xiii, on two ways, this being the kind of text (a preacher's >handbook, here discoursing on Accedia) that Chaucer's Parson might have >been using himself: > > And notice that although both are evil: to sin, and after confession to > slide back, yet the latter is worse, according to the words of Peter 2: >"For > it is better not to know the way of justice than after knowing it to > turn back." And thus it is said in Ecclesiasticus 2: "Woe to the sinner > who goes on the earth two ways." For two ways are put before man, one >that > leads to life--that is the one man takes when he clings to God by his good > deeds, of which is written: "This is the way, walk in it"--; the other >that > leads to death, of which [it] is said in Proverbs 24: "There is a way >that > seems good to a man; but its ends lead to death." This way one takes when > one withdraws from God and clings to the devil by sin. ... [There follows > an anecdote of a dog who who heard two horns calling him to dinner in two > different directions -- i.e., a good life leading to heaven vs. fleshly > delight leading to hedonistic satisfactions -- and got no meal at all, > because of his vacillation] And thus, throughout the whole day, that is, > this life, they [the vacillating] follow a double path and will find no >rest > in a good life, as is said in Ecclesiasticus 3: "A heart that goes two >ways > shall have no rest." So, when the night of death comes, they will fail to > reach either banquet, for when the soul leaves the body, they go down to > hell, deprived of the joy of heaven and pulled away from the delights of >the > flesh. Therefore it is the way of wisdom that, once one has come out of >the > state of sin, one does not return to it but rather remains firmly in the > state of grace; hence the words of Ecclesiasticus 5: "Be steadfast in the > way of the Lord and in the truth of your judgment. (Wenzel tr. 485) > > There is also the path as that of bewilderment or as misleading, as in >Machaut, Remede de Fortune, ed./tr. Wimsatt and Kibler, where the lover is >self-led into a comforting but alien and secluded and solitary garden of >delights, in a passage resembling the one from Romance of the Rose cited by >Kathryn Walls: > > Thus I left my dear lady and went away miserable ... eager to reach some > hidden place where I could cease my weeping and regain my composure. ... I > went along thus for a while, ever lost in my thoughts, until I saw a very > beautiful garden called the Park of Hesdin (Hedon -- as in hedonism). > Then > I headed straight for it and didn't stop until I'd come there; but I > couldn't enter because it was surrounded and enclosed by high walls, and >the > road was not open to one and all. Nonetheless I followed the paths and > trails I saw before me until I reached a closed gate, which was beautiful > and nobly situated in a remote spot, far from people. I raised the latch >of > small wicket; and after I'd lifted it, I went in. But I saw no one >within, > which made me happier, because I wanted to be alone if possible. And when > I'd succeeded in entering and found myself all alone, I bolted the lock on > the wicket. I walked along among the plantings, which were more beautiful > than any I'd ever seen, nor will I ever see any so beautiful, so fair, so > agreeable, so pleasing, or so delightful. I could never describe the > marvels ... I can well say that one could not seek any diversion in the >air, > in water, or on land that he'd not find there imediately, always read to > answer his wish. ... I wandered up hills and down until I came upon a >valley > in which I saw a fountain that was perfeclty clear and beautiful, >surrounded > by trees and grass; and around it had sprung up a little hedge of wild > roses. But I saw no beaten or well-trod path or trail, only the thick, > sharp-bladed grass. I surmised that few people came there, so I set off >in > that direction. I passed through the little hedge and came to the clear, > limpid fountain, where I washed my face and eyes; aferwards I sat down, > because the place I'd thus reached seemed very secluded. ¶ Then I grew > deeply despondent, blaming myself for having left my lady as I did. >(Remedy, 771-840) > > We learn from this, then, that a path may be described as green because it >is little > trodden, as opposed to its being green mainly because it is inviting -- or >seductive. > > In the Cursor Mundi Seth is commissioned by his dying father Adam to go to > paradise to fetch him the medicinal oil of mercy: > > To Seth his son thus he said: > "Son, he said, thou must go > To paradise from which I came, > To cherubim at the gate > Who keep the way to it." > Seth said to his father then, > "How stands it father, and where?" > "I shall tell you," he said, "saying > How you shall take the right way -- > Toward the east end of the vale yonder: > A green way you shall find -- > In that way you shall find and see > The steps of thy mother and me. >For follow in that green grass > That ever since has been seen > Where we came -- going inadvisedly, > When we were put out of paradise -- > Into this same wretched vale [=slade] > There where myself first was made: >For the grossness of our sin. > No grass may grow since therein -- > That same will lead you on the way [=gate], > From hence to paradise's gate [=3ate]. > (Morris ed. I:81, ll. 1242ff, after Trinity ms. [doubtfully > rendered]) > > -- This route would seem to be a kind of putative original for a green >pathway to life. > > Pathway is word combining two possible different meanings -- a path >through > a forest is generally narrow and singular, a footpath, a thing to be > scrutinzed critically, whereas the way west takes in a quarter of the > compass and is thronged by wagon wheels, the ways of God to man are many, > and all of India is found upon the Grand Trunk Road. See Gregory, Morals >on > Job: "For a 'path' is usually narrower than a 'way;'' but by 'ways' we > understand actions, so by 'paths' we not unjustly understand the mere > thoughts of them. "So God 'looketh narrowly into all our paths, ' in that > in all our several actions He takes account of the thoughts of the heart > too; and He 'marketh the prints of our feet,' ... And very commonly, when > we do some things wrong, whereas our brethren see it, we are setting them >a > bad example, and our foot being as it were turned out of the way, we leave > to those that follow our footesteps all awry, while by our own deeds we >lead > the way for other men's conscience to stumble." (XI.xlvii, 63) Gregory > contrasts "the broad way of the present life" with "the narrow paths of > heavenly precept" -- for "who can be ignorant that a path is narrower than >a > way?" (XXXI.xxiv, 43). > > E.K.'s passage has inspired Milton not only in the sonnet's "Wisely hast >shun'd the broad way and the green" (which seems to be a version of "the >flowery way that leads to the broad gate and the [devil's] great fire" in >All's Well, IV.v.53f. after Matt. 7:13), which John Leonard cites, but also >inspired the poet in regard to stating the subject of PL (a poem which ends >with the word "way"): > > Compare: > 'For though the trespasse of the first man brought death into the world, >as the guerdon of sinne, yet being ouercome by the death of one, that dyed >for al, it is now made (as Chaucer sayth) the grene path way to lyfe'. > > ...Mans First Disobedience ... > ...that Forbidden Tree, whose mortal taste > Brought Death into the World, > ... till one greater Man > Restore us, and regain the blissful Seat > > The path in Job 8:12-13, 16 is cited by Shawcross on the sonnet, as >"Whilst it is yet in his greeness, and not cut down, it withereth before >any other herb. So are the paths of all that forget God; and the >hypocrite's hope shall perish: ... He is green before the sun..." And >this does indeed sound rather like the green pathway to hell, Leonard >citing my teachers Bush and Woodhouse citing Smart on Ascham misciting >Chaucer (= Ascham, Toxophilus, English Works, ed. W. A. Wright, Cambridge, >1904, 23: "Chauser doth saye verie well in the Parsons tale, the greene >path waye to hel."). -- Jim N. > > > > > And On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:13:28 +1200 > Kathryn Walls <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> If spiritually negative pathways are relevant, cf. the path within the >> Garden of Love RR 729ff. "Tho wente I forth on my right hond/Doun by a >> lytel path I fond/Of mentes full, and fenell grene/And faste by, without >> wene,/Sir Myrthe I fond". But there must be many such paths, I realize. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >>From: Sidney-Spenser Discussion List >> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Leonard >> Sent: Thursday, 14 June 2007 11:35 p.m. >> To: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: Re: The grene path way to lyfe >> >> Dear Bert, >> >> The line you quote immediately made me think of "the broad way and the >> green" In Milton's Sonnet IX, so I checked the Milton Variorum and found >> a >> goldmine of information, including this, from Ascham, Toxophilus, >> English >> Works, ed. W. A. Wright, Cambridge, 1904, 23: "Chauser doth saye verie >> well >> in the Parsons tale, the greene path waye to hel." Woodhouse and Bush >> add: >> "The phrase is not in the Parson's Tale and Ascham's memory was at >> fault, as >> Smart observes." >> >> So, I find myself wondering whether E.K. has picked this up from Ascham, >> and >> that what we have here is one scholar's bad memory infecting another's >> (a >> common occurrence, even today). E.K. changes the significance of the >> path >> (it leads to virtue), but that might be either a further memory lapse or >> a >> deliberate inversion of Matt. 7.13 (the broad way) and Job 8.12-13 (the >> 'greenness' of the 'the paths of all that forget God'). One last >> thought: >> Puritans often thought that Chaucer had written Piers Plowman. I wonder >> if >> Langland might produce a missing piece of the puzzle? >> >> Best, >> >> John Leonard >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>From: "A.C. Hamilton" <[log in to unmask]> >> To: <[log in to unmask]> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2007 7:20 PM >> Subject: The grene path way to lyfe >> >> >>>A time when the whole world seems ready to mount a green bandwagon - in >> >>>Canada there is even a Federal Green Party - seems an appropriate time >> to >>>raise a matter that has bothered me for many years, in fact, from the >> time >>>I wrote an article on The Shepheardes Calender over fifty years ago. It >> >>>concerns E. K.'s gloss on the November emblem: 'For though the >> trespasse of >>>the first man brought death into the world, as the guerdon of sinne, >> yet >>>being ouercome by the death of one, that dyed for al, it is now made >> (as >>>Chaucer sayth) the grene path way to lyfe'. >>> >>> Evidently Chaucer did not say this though only a major poet would be >>> capable of such a powerful statement, even more powerful, surely, than >> >>> Marvell's 'green Thought in a green shade'. I recall making my way >>> unsuccessfully through Thynne in the hope that the line was from a >> poem >>> attributed to Chaucer. In 1982 I used E. K.'s phrase as the title of >> an >>> essay on Spenser's poem in the hope that I would be shamed into >> finding >>> its source. I didn't and I am. >>> >>> I can't recall that any comment on E. K.'s gloss in later >>> twentieth-century editions of the poem, and, surprisingly, not even in >> the >>> Variorum Spenser. Of recent editions, the Yale Shorter Poems, has no >>> comment at all. In a recent edition of the poem, Douglas Brooks-Davies >> >>> writes: 'E. K. paraphrases the opening of the Parson's Tale (itself >>> translated from Jeremiah 6:16: "seeth . . . which is the good way, and >> >>> walketh in that way, and ye shall find refreshing for your souls".' >> That >>> tale begins by citing Jeremiah: 'Stondeth upon the weyes, and seeth >> and >>> axeth of olde pathes (that is to seyn, of olde sentences) which is the >> >>> good wey, / and walketh in that wey'. In his edition, Richard McCabe >>> glosses: 'cf. the opening sentences of The Parson's tale quoting >> Jeremiah >>> 6:16'. Robinson's edition of Chaucer notes that Chaucer cites the >> Vulgate; >>> and the Geneva Bible, which E. K. would certainly know, urges that we >>> 'aske for the olde waie, which is the good way & walke therein, and >> yet >>> shal finde rest for your soules'. No hint here that death is 'the >> grene >>> path way to lyfe', though in the November eclogue, death for Dido is >> the >>> green pathway to life, for once resurrected, she is seen walking in >>> 'fieldes ay fresh, the grasse ay greene', which is redolent of the >> 'green >>> pasture' promised by the Psalmist. >>> >>> Is E. K.'s gloss simply unglossable, apart from idle speculation that >>> Spenser as 'our new poet' demonstrated that he has replaced 'that good >> old >>> poet', Chaucer, by attributing to him a line that he wrote himself? >>> Bert >>> > > [log in to unmask] > James Nohrnberg > Dept. of English, Bryan Hall 219 > Univ. of Virginia > P.O Box 400121 > Charlottesville, VA 22904-4121 [log in to unmask] James Nohrnberg Dept. of English, Bryan Hall 219 Univ. of Virginia P.O Box 400121 Charlottesville, VA 22904-4121