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Swanson, Gunnar wrote: > Chris tells us that "a Masters degree with an ambitious main project . . . is a very good incubator for future Doctoral students" but the masters degree being discussed here--an MFA--is not a way stop on the way to the "real" degree. It is the terminal studio degree in the US. > > It is great if any experience leads to new vistas but are you advocating forming the major degree requirements around hopes that someone would like to take another direction? Should JD and MD degrees be reworked in hopes that lawyers and physicians will become criminology and physiology researchers? Hi Gunnar, I'm tempted to say yes. In fact I would give a qualified yes - if we don't hold open the option that our best students may encounter new opportunities in their studies, and allow for more than one outcome to a degree, we are failing them and failing our professions. The fact that students first become aware of research during Masters study indicates that we have to enable them to go further as researchers if they wish. Many of the best design research students that I work with all started MA study with the intention of advancing their professional skills but saw new opportunities in research before they finished their MA, I don't apologise for the fact that some of them have gained doctorates and jobs in universities as a result of owning significant new knowledge. But the proper answer is that this is an international forum and it is concerned first with doctoral study and research. I answered the question asked with an account of my own experience and issues that I feel are relevant to Masters study in the UK. Others can use that information as they wish. However the guidance I quoted from Phil Agre is coming from a US position and the fact that it seems to dovetail with my understanding of progressive practice in my country seems to be interesting. Maybe I'm lucky to be in a country where academic structures are quite fluid so we can re-invent ourselves, and it has been said before that the UK is good at developing new approaches but may suffer from a loss of quality control at the margins whereas the US is very well-controlled but maybe, as a result, slow in validating new academic programs. We've had a discussion recently on this list about programs in the US (and elsewhere I am sure) which do not encourage an enquiring or critical approach to Graphic Design. It seems to me that a more integrated approach that encouraged students to engage with the kind of critical thinking we expect from researchers would not do any harm at all. If you want an example of how things could be different, I have been impressed by the way that Frank Cronk, Jill Dacey, Colleen Taugher and their colleagues at University of Idaho have developed an approach to interpreting scientific data that started as a new work opportunity for graphic design graduates and went on to become a genuine partnership between designers and scientists in understanding and interpreting the data that scientists were producing. best wishes from Sheffield Chris ******************** Professor Chris Rust Head of Art and Design Research Centre Sheffield Hallam University Psalter Lane, S11 8UZ, UK +44 114 225 2706 (direct) +44 114 225 2686 (research admin) [log in to unmask] www.chrisrust.net Swanson, Gunnar wrote: > Chris tells us that "a Masters degree with an ambitious main project . . . is a very good incubator for future Doctoral students" but the masters degree being discussed here--an MFA--is not a way stop on the way to the "real" degree. It is the terminal studio degree in the US. > > It is great if any experience leads to new vistas but are you advocating forming the major degree requirements around hopes that someone would like to take another direction? Should JD and MD degrees be reworked in hopes that lawyers and physicians will become criminology and physiology researchers? > > Gunnar > ---------- > Gunnar Swanson Design Office > 1910 East 6th Street > Greenville, North Carolina 27858 > USA > > [log in to unmask] > +1 252 258 7006 > > http://www.gunnarswanson.com > > at East Carolina University: > [log in to unmask] > +1 252 328 2839 > > >