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medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture Hi, Ursula, There is a folk myth that the spirit of the deceased wanders around and will try to acquire a new body and take over the other person's mind as well. I suspect this piece of folklore is rather old. dual personalities, two spirits in one body, zombies, etc. have been around a long time. Yes, people do believe in this. Two personalities call for exorcism. It's the reason some East European Jews cover their mirrors during the week after a death and funeral and no knots are allowed because a knot could bind the spirit to the earthly realm. It also seems to be behind the wakes where people deliberately get drunk so the spirit of the departed will not recognize his/her family and friends and pick on someone else. There is also a superstition that if a male child is born on the exact date of a recently deceased grandfather's death, the spirit of the grandfather will enter the child. There are lots more along these lines. A superstition about wearing black so the relatives would not be recognized is not only possible, but likely. Folklore, hmmm. Perhaps spirits flitting around trying to take over another body may be among the motifs in: Antti Amatus Aarne, 1867-1925. The Types of the Folk-Tale: A Classification and Bibliography. Trans. Stith Thompson. New York: Burt Franklin, 1928. At any rate, it's a place to start. Rochelle >Hi Everyone, > >I really would like to go back to the original posting as there is another >thing mentioned there which has not been followed up: that of the spirits. >Black was supposedly worn so that the spirit of the deceased couldn't >recognise the family members and friends. >That really interests me because why shouldn't the deceased recognise >family and friends. In the case of murder ok, but if you bury a loved one >then i expect the spirit of the deceased would be happy to know that >he/she is in the company of family and friends. >Any ideas on how to go about this question? >Were the spirits of the ancestors not valued? >greetings, Ursula > > >"Cormack, Margaret Jean" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > Yes, there's the rub! It seems that all the examples cited so far > are aristocratic. As I recall the original > hypothesis was that the change of clothes was meant to deceive the > dead so they would not >follow the mourners home. This would seem to suppose that EVERYONE has a >spare set of black >clothing that they could keep on hand for such events - which seems >unlikely at the lower levels >of society. I know of a few anecdotes pertaining to pre-Christian times >where the dead were "fooled" >to prevent their return, but they donīt involve clothing. I would think >that most medieval Christians would >think that burial in consecrated ground would, in and of itself, be enough >to keep the dead quiet. (Unless >of course, they had major unconfessed sins, in which case the consecrated >ground might itself reject >them, as found I believe in Gregory the Great's DIALOGUES.) I donīt know >of any examples of people >being followed home, though. > Meg > >PS In China, the color of mourning is white, not black. > > >---------- >From: medieval-religion - Scholarly discussions of medieval religious >culture [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Revd Gordon >Plumb >Sent: Friday, February 23, 2007 12:51 PM >To: [log in to unmask] >Subject: Re: [M-R] Wearing Black at Funerals > >medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > >I don't know if it was universal to wear black in the MA - but checking a >couple of facsimiles of manuscripts I have to hand, there are plenty of >black-robed mourners in the funeral scenes in the Hours of Catherine of >Cleves, and on f 184b of the Hastings Hours in the British Library there >are again black-robed mourners. So maybe not entirely an old fd tale - >but as to the significance of wearing black.... ah, there's another story! > >Gordon Plumb > > >********************************************************************** To >join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: >[log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: >[log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: >leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report >problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: >[log in to unmask] For further information, visit >our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html > >********************************************************************** To >join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: >[log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: >[log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: >leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report >problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: >[log in to unmask] For further information, visit >our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html > > > >Now you can ><http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail/uk/taglines/default/nowyoucan/reading_pane/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=40565/*http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html>scan >emails quickly with a reading pane. Get the new ><http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail/uk/taglines/default/nowyoucan/reading_pane/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=40565/*http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html>Yahoo! >Mail. >********************************************************************** To >join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: >[log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: >[log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: >leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report >problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: >[log in to unmask] For further information, visit >our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask] For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html