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Well, that's true... and I think the point is not that anybody should be contesting the aim of reducing speeding and deaths on the road, but the method. The question is whether technological surveillance is the right or best way of achieving that goal, and I don't think it is... But the other thing is that these people are not Winston Smith's and their idea of individualism is based on being allowed to drive as fast as they and damn more vulnerable people like cyclists and pedestrians (and people in less powerful cars). The fact that they adopt discourses with appeal to our notion of romaticised resistance does not mean that they actually are carrying our the resistance for the reasons we would approve. And as a cyclist, I would rather not be literally squelched by drivers who've decided that destroying speed cameras constitutes "heroic resistance to rampant, individualism-squelching"! David. >-----Original Message----- >From: Research and teaching on surveillance >[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Roger Clarke >Sent: 31 October 2006 14:21 >To: [log in to unmask] >Subject: Re: NY TIMES: Speed Cameras in UK > > >Sounds like anyone who's looking for heroic resistance to rampant, >individualism-squelching surveillance had better not look on this >list. The ivory tower seems to have no truck with Winston Smiths. > >I take particular exception to the statement that "Surveillance is >not sinister as such". Surveillance of objects perhaps not; but >surveillance of humans has an inevitable and substantial impact on >human behaviour. A corollary of the Hawthorne experiments was that >humans aren't the same when they're observed. Many of us would call >that process 'de-humanisation'. Do social scientists *really* want >to repeat the mistakes of the physical scientists and engineers, and >pretend that they have to avoid values-loaded research in order to >achieve the saintly mantle of 'scientist'?? > >I originally addressed this to my fellow information systems >academics and professionals, but perhaps a version's needed for other >audiences: > >Economic, Legal and Social Implications of Information >Technology http://www.anu.edu.au/people/Roger.Clarke/DV/ELSIC.html > >-- >Roger Clarke >http://www.anu.edu.au/people/Roger.Clarke/ > >Xamax Consultancy Pty Ltd 78 Sidaway St, Chapman ACT 2611 >AUSTRALIA > Tel: +61 2 6288 1472, and 6288 6916 >mailto:[log in to unmask] >http://www.xamax.com.au/ > >Visiting Professor in Info Science & Eng Australian National >University >Visiting Professor in the eCommerce Program University of >Hong Kong >Visiting Professor in the Cyberspace Law & Policy Centre >Uni of NSW > >**************************************************** >This is a message from the SURVEILLANCE listserv >for research and teaching in surveillance studies. > >To unsubscribe, please send the following message to ><[log in to unmask]>: > >UNSUBSCRIBE SURVEILLANCE > >For further help, please visit: > >http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help >**************************************************** > **************************************************** This is a message from the SURVEILLANCE listserv for research and teaching in surveillance studies. To unsubscribe, please send the following message to <[log in to unmask]>: UNSUBSCRIBE SURVEILLANCE For further help, please visit: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help ****************************************************