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And back to alcohol Rowdy Yates Senior Research Fellow Scottish Addiction Studies Sociology, Social Policy & Criminology Section Department of Applied Social Science University of Stirling W: http://www.dass.stir.ac.uk/sections/scot-ad/ T: +44(0)1786 - 467737 M: 07960 - 403392 > ---------- > From: [log in to unmask] on behalf of Dave > Reply To: [log in to unmask] > Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 11:29 AM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: [TC-OF] Community of Communities (Mixed populations) > > Hello Rowdy, > > "knotty problem of excessive drinking in tthe re-entry phase when residents get their "drinking > privileges". > > Excessive drinking in the re-entry phase, and often ex-addict staff was a major problem in my time. > Has this changed or is it something that is still being addressed. I would be interested to know. People who have had a serious drug problem and remain drug free, often have to make the same decision with regard to alcohol. > > Warmest Dave > On 10 Aug 2005, at 10:33, Rowdy Yates wrote: > > > Craig > > This is immensely helpful. Thanks. And thanks to Sarah too for the information regarding Elizabeth House. Alcohol (and reintroduction of alcohol) is a major issue in drug-free TCs and has caused much consternation over the years. Interestingly, I think I'm right in saying that Ceis Modena allows residents to drink a little wine with their meal during the weekends (which is when the families visit). It would be interesting to know whether this normalisation of the celebratory role of alcohol in their community a) is abused by some residents at some times and b) has any impact on the knotty problem of excessive drinking in tthe re-entry phase when residentss get their "drinking privileges". Not sure. And I'm not sure if I've got the right TC - I'm almost certain that I've been to one of the Italian TCs where this happened.. > > > > Rowdy Yates > Senior Research Fellow > Scottish Addiction Studies > Sociology, Social Policy & Criminology Section > Department of Applied Social Science > University of Stirling > > W: http://www.dass.stir.ac.uk/sections/scot-ad/ > > T: +44(0)1786 - 467737 > > M: 07960 - 403392 > > ---------- > From: [log in to unmask] on behalf of Craig Fees > Reply To: [log in to unmask] > Sent: Tuesday, August 9, 2005 10:20 PM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: RE: [TC-OF] Community of Communities (Mixed populations) > > Dear Rowdy, > > > > My little brain kicks in, a bit. > > > > Josephine Lomax-Simpson created the Messenger House Trust for homeless/single mothers and their children; and created a parallel charity called the Hutchinson Settlement, where students could live cheaply in return for participation in MHT. Which then brings in the whole Settlement Movement > -> the Toynbee Halls and Hull Houses, which in a way could include > "> placements> "> > -> the placements of students in this or that community as part of their training. Then there are Forest School Camps, in which the ethos and traditions of Forest School carry on with a low-key commitment to including among the groups children referred by local authorities; which reminds us of Wennington School, where local authority-referred children shared their school lives with children sent by parents. Soteria House in California was statistically most successful when it was the locus of an extended community of former staff and residents (if this, too, counts; and if one is pursuing the role of the non-focal community, then I expect one should). > > > > The tradition of sharing your home with children or families with difficulties is a deep one, and has been at the root of a number of communities over the years, in which the logic developed into an intentional place (although my brain hasn> '> t turned over quite enough to start throwing out names. The Mulberry Bush started more or less in this way.) Geel always comes into the conversation. > > > > To really get at this, one would look at communities in which there has been sometimes very radical inclusion/integration of local community. I would have to check the recording, but about ten years ago I recorded a couple, Maurice and Bella Dobbs (for whom Bunny Barron had acted as a consultant), who incorporated among their community for the usual mix of difficult, delinquent, disturbed youngsters a kind of day centre for elderly locals. Their work struck me at the time as very impressive, intensely human. Jon Broad> '> s account of Finchden and its communities outside the community> ...> The role of outside > '> friends> '> (my word) to support and involve themselves in the lives of residents having left this or that community> ...> Philadelphia Association. > > > > New Barns was named for Barns House in Scotland, where David Wills went (fled?) at the beginning of WWII after Hawkspur. It was established in 1965, with David Wills as first Chair of Governors, and John Cross as Principal (until recently Chair and Executive Director of the PETT, now Executive Director. His sister Cynthia was part of the founding team of New Barns, and is now PETT> '> s Chair). It closed in 1992, under circumstances I> '> ve recounted before (okay, five years ago on the old ATC list. Read > "> The Mystery of Bryn Estyn> "> and you> '> ll get the drift. 2005 marks the tenth anniversary of the end of the Crown Court trial, which ended in a unanimous verdict from the jury of not guilty (of a crime, by definition, which had not been committed), a letter from them to the Lord Chancellor to say the case should never have been brought, and a visit by the entire former jury to a > '> celebration> '> at the school with former children, family, friends, members of the team.). > > > > As for not being > "> hot> "> > -> I can> '> t tell you how much I> '> ve learned about the addictions side of therapeutic communities over the past six or so months. > > > > Craig > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [log in to unmask] [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Rowdy Yates > Sent: 09 August 2005 10:05 > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: RE: [TC-OF] Community of Communities > > > > Thanks Craig. Got that wrong. Was New Barns the one that David Wills was at before Hawkspur? I'm not particularly hot on this area of TC. > > _____ > > > > Therapeutic Community Open Forum > Created in December 2004 for all in the therapeutic community movement worldwide for the discussion of matters of concern or common interest. > > Sponsored and promoted by the following organisations. > Association of Therapeutic Communities (ATC) > Planned Environment Therapy Trust (PETT) > Community of Communities (COC) > Charterhouse Group of Therapeutic Communities (CHG) > The views expressed within this group do not necessarily represent the views of these organisations. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Intentional communities Chris evans Strong > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > ? Visit your group "TC-OF" on the web. > ? > ? To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > ? [log in to unmask] > ? > ? Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > -- > > The University of Stirling is a university established in Scotland by charter at Stirling, FK9 4LA. Privileged/Confidential Information may be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message (or responsible for delivery of the message to such person), you may not disclose, copy or deliver this message to anyone and any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. In> such case, you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Please advise immediately if you or your employer do not consent to Internet email for messages of this kind. > > > > Therapeutic Community Open Forum > Created in December 2004 for all in the therapeutic community movement worldwide for the discussion of matters of concern or common interest. > Sponsored and promoted by the following organisations. > Association of Therapeutic Communities (ATC) > Planned Environment Therapy Trust (PETT) > Community of Communities (COC) > Charterhouse Group of Therapeutic Communities (CHG) > The views expressed within this group do not necessarily represent the views of these organisations. > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > ? Visit your group "TC-OF" on the web. > > ? To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > [log in to unmask] > > ? Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > -- > > The University of Stirling is a university established in Scotland by charter at Stirling, FK9 4LA. Privileged/Confidential Information may be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message (or responsible for delivery of the message to such person), you may not disclose, copy or deliver this message to anyone and any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. In such case, you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Please advise immediately if you or your employer do not consent to Internet email for messages of this kind. > Hello Rowdy, > > "knotty problem of excessive drinking in tthe re-entry phase when > residents get their "drinking > privileges". > > Excessive drinking in the re-entry phase, and often ex-addict staff was > a major problem in my time. > Has this changed or is it something that is still being addressed. I > would be interested to know. People who have had a serious drug > problem and remain drug free, often have to make the same decision with > regard to alcohol. > > Warmest Dave > On 10 Aug 2005, at 10:33, Rowdy Yates wrote: > > > Craig > > > > This is immensely helpful. Thanks. And thanks to Sarah too for the > > information regarding Elizabeth House. Alcohol (and reintroduction of > > alcohol) is a major issue in drug-free TCs and has caused much > > consternation over the years. Interestingly, I think I'm right in > > saying that Ceis Modena allows residents to drink a little wine with > > their meal during the weekends (which is when the families visit). It > > would be interesting to know whether this normalisation of the > > celebratory role of alcohol in their community a) is abused by some > > residents at some times and b) has any impact on the knotty problem of > > excessive drinking in tthe re-entry phase when residentss get their > > "drinking privileges". Not sure. And I'm not sure if I've got the > > right TC - I'm almost certain that I've been to one of the Italian TCs > > where this happened.. > > > > > > > > Rowdy Yates > > Senior Research Fellow > > Scottish Addiction Studies > > Sociology, Social Policy & Criminology Section > > Department of Applied Social Science > > University of Stirling > > > > W: http://www.dass.stir.ac.uk/sections/scot-ad/ > > > > T: +44(0)1786 - 467737 > > > > M: 07960 - 403392 > > > > ---------- > > From: [log in to unmask] on behalf of Craig Fees > > Reply To: [log in to unmask] > > Sent: Tuesday, August 9, 2005 10:20 PM > > To: [log in to unmask] > > Subject: RE: [TC-OF] Community of Communities (Mixed > > populations) > > > > Dear Rowdy, > > > > > > > > My little brain kicks in, a bit. > > > > > > > > Josephine Lomax-Simpson created the Messenger House Trust for > > homeless/single mothers and their children; and created a parallel > > > charity called the Hutchinson Settlement, where students could live > > cheaply in return for participation in MHT. Which then brings in the > > whole Settlement Movement > -> the Toynbee Halls and Hull Houses, which > > in a way could include > "> placements> "> > -> the placements of students in > > this or that community as part of their training. Then there are > > Forest School Camps, in which the ethos and traditions of Forest > > School carry on with a low-key commitment to including among the > > groups children referred by local authorities; which reminds us of > > Wennington School, where local authority-referred children shared > > their school lives with children sent by parents. Soteria House in > > California was statistically most successful when it was the locus of > > an extended community of former staff and residents (if this, too, > > counts; and if one is pursuing the role of the non-focal community, > > then I expect one should). > > > > > > > > The tradition of sharing your home with children or families with > > difficulties is a deep one, and has been at the root of a number of > > communities over the years, in which the logic developed into an > > intentional place (although my brain hasn> '> t turned over quite enough > > to start throwing out names. The Mulberry Bush started more or less in > > this way.) Geel always comes into the conversation. > > > > > > > > To really get at this, one would look at communities in which there > > has been sometimes very radical inclusion/integration of local > > community. I would have to check the recording, but about ten years > > ago I recorded a couple, Maurice and Bella Dobbs (for whom Bunny > > Barron had acted as a consultant), who incorporated among their > > community for the usual mix of difficult, delinquent, disturbed > > youngsters a kind of day centre for elderly locals. Their work struck > > me at the time as very impressive, intensely human. Jon Broad> '> s > > account of Finchden and its communities outside the community> ...> The role > > of outside > '> friends> '> (my word) to support and involve themselves in > > the lives of residents having left this or that community> ...> > > Philadelphia Association. > > > > > > > > New Barns was named for Barns House in Scotland, where David Wills > > went (fled?) at the beginning of WWII after Hawkspur. It was > > established in 1965, with David Wills as first Chair of Governors, and > > John Cross as Principal (until recently Chair and Executive Director > > of the PETT, now Executive Director. His sister Cynthia was part of > > the founding team of New Barns, and is now PETT> '> s Chair). It closed in > > 1992, under circumstances I> '> ve recounted before (okay, five years ago > > on the old ATC list. Read > "> The Mystery of Bryn Estyn> "> and you> '> ll get > > the drift. 2005 marks the tenth anniversary of the end of the Crown > > Court trial, which ended in a unanimous verdict from the jury of not > > guilty (of a crime, by definition, which had not been committed), a > > letter from them to the Lord Chancellor to say the case should never > > have been brought, and a visit by the entire former jury to a > > > '> celebration> '> at the school with former children, family, friends, > > members of the team.). > > > > > > > > As for not being > "> hot> "> > -> I can> '> t tell you how much I> '> ve learned about > > the addictions side of therapeutic communities over the past six or so > > months. > > > > > > > > Craig > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [log in to unmask] [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf > > Of Rowdy Yates > > Sent: 09 August 2005 10:05 > > To: [log in to unmask] > > Subject: RE: [TC-OF] Community of Communities > > > > > > > > Thanks Craig. Got that wrong. Was New Barns the one that David Wills > > was at before Hawkspur? I'm not particularly hot on this area of TC. > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > Therapeutic Community Open Forum > > Created in December 2004 for all in the therapeutic community movement > > worldwide for the discussion of matters of concern or common interest. > > > > Sponsored and promoted by the following organisations. > > Association of Therapeutic Communities (ATC) > > Planned Environment Therapy Trust (PETT) > > Community of Communities (COC) > > Charterhouse Group of Therapeutic Communities (CHG) > > The views expressed within this group do not necessarily represent the > > views of these organisations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Intentional communities Chris evans Strong > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > ? Visit your group "TC-OF" on the web. > > ? > > ? To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > ? [log in to unmask] > > ? > > ? Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > -- > > > > The University of Stirling is a university established in Scotland by > > charter at Stirling, FK9 4LA. Privileged/Confidential Information may > > be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated > > in this message (or responsible for delivery of the message to such > > person), you may not disclose, copy or deliver this message to anyone > > and any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is > > prohibited and may be unlawful. In such case, you should destroy this > > message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Please advise > > immediately if you or your employer do not consent to Internet email > > for messages of this kind. > > > > > > > > Therapeutic Community Open Forum > > Created in December 2004 for all in the therapeutic community > > movement worldwide for the discussion of matters of concern or common > > interest. > > Sponsored and promoted by the following organisations. > > Association of Therapeutic Communities (ATC) > > Planned Environment Therapy Trust (PETT) > > Community of Communities (COC) > > Charterhouse Group of Therapeutic Communities (CHG) > > The views expressed within this group do not necessarily represent > > the views of these organisations. > > > > > > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > ? Visit your group "TC-OF" on the web. > > > > ? To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > [log in to unmask] > > > > ? Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > -- > > > > The University of Stirling is a university established in Scotland by > > charter at Stirling, FK9 4LA. Privileged/Confidential Information may > > be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated > > in this message (or responsible for delivery of the message to such > > person), you may not disclose, copy or deliver this message to anyone > > and any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is > > prohibited and may be unlawful. In such case, you should destroy this > > message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Please advise > > immediately if you or your employer do not consent to Internet email > > for messages of this kind. > > -- The University of Stirling is a university established in Scotland by charter at Stirling, FK9 4LA. Privileged/Confidential Information may be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message (or responsible for delivery of the message to such person), you may not disclose, copy or deliver this message to anyone and any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. In such case, you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Please advise immediately if you or your employer do not consent to Internet email for messages of this kind.