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Hi Muriel et al. 5 key essentials to assure adequate living standards - clean air, clean water, healthy food, warm clothes and snug shelter??? Sounds boring, Muriel. Your prize is my starting point. I really do not agree with your contention that your "5 key essentials" are that at all. I can do all that with an axe, a gun and a knife on my own land. There's sex, dope, and rock 'n roll, literature, music, philosophy, fun and games, medical support, and a desire to travel and meet new people and experience new things. All those require social interaction at some level and travel and I think your somewhat idyllic list would drive most of us spare with boredom within weeks. I'm here to explore the possibilities and that's what makes it worth breathing. If you put your notion of outcomes up against the above desires or building blocks of a life worth living, it changes the equation radically. Engineering activity is there to expedite a lot more than improving the physical living standards of people. Bob Murphy PO Guildford VIC 3451 Australia Craig Fletcher wrote: > Hi all, > I didn't get Shimon's e-mail so i've had to reply through the forum. > You may hit delete NOW. You may already have this info, but these > guys are good to talk to for the Australian statistics you're looking > for, some of it free to public. > http://www.arrb.org.au/ > > and Hi to Muriel, and thanks for another interesting debate. What is > a non-key essential<grin>? It reminds me of NASA's categories of > "known knowns, known unknowns, and unknown unknowns," where they > actually listed what was in the last category...wow they're smart! > > and Hi to John Bullas, i like the flower in the hair, but don't all > the sheep eat them in NZ? Must get very grotty. And who the hell is > Eric Satie, do you have a sound byte for 'Les Trois Gymnopedies' that > you can send me? > > cheers all, > craig > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Craig Fletcher, BSc, BEng(mech), MIEAust > Simulations Engineer, RABiT www.rabit.com.au > <http://www.rabit.com.au/>PhD candidate, Melbourne University, Dept. > of Mechanical and Manufacturing Engineering www.mame.mu.oz.au > <http://www.mame.mu.oz.au/>ph:+61 3 8344 6680 > fax: +61 3 9347 8784 > e-mail: [log in to unmask] > snail-mail: > Department of Mechanical and Manufacturing Engineering > University of Melbourne > Victoria 3010 Australia > > 'This e-mail and any attachments may contain personal information or > information that is otherwise confidential or the subject of > copyright. Any use, disclosure or copying of any part of it is > prohibited. The University does not warrant that this email or any > attachments are free from viruses or defects. Please check any > attachments for viruses and defects before opening them. If this > e-mail is received in error please delete it and notify us by return > e-mail. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > At 05:26 AM 7/9/2004, Muriel Strand wrote: > >> i would suggest that the cost-effectiveness of highway research programs >> tends to be low for the same reason as typical engineering projects. >> usually the focus is on the project itself, and how well the engineering >> works, rather than on the final purpose of the project. >> >> what i mean by final purpose is the basic underlying set of goals for >> virtually all engineering activity, to improve the physical living >> standards of human beings. there are 5 key essentials to assure >> adequate living standards - clean air, clean water, healthy food, warm >> clothes and snug shelter. >> >> how effective really are highway projects and highway research in >> assisting us in realizing these 5 essentials? usually the pat answer is >> that highways facilitate mobility so people can more easily travel to >> transport these things from one place to another. but this is simply a >> means to an end. and highways also cover up lots of perfectly good land >> in ways that compromise access to or quality of these essentials. in >> addition, excessive reliance on vehicle travel leads to many health >> problems related to obesity and lack of exercise, especially in the u.s. >> and increasingly elsewhere. >> >> i recommend keeping a focus on these key essentials as the true goals of >> human technology & economic activity. as with engineers, economists >> typically also focus on means (in their case, money) rather than the >> true ends that are really driving all this activity. >> >> let's keep our eyes on the prize. >> >> muriel >> >> שמעון נסיכי wrote: >> >> > Dear Friends >> > >> > I am asking for your help in providing me or referring me to any >> > sources which may have information relevant to the following issues: >> > >> > 1. Percentage of highway research budgets as a percentage of total >> > (national) expenditure on highways. >> > >> > 2. Data on cost effectiveness of national research programs (e. g. >> > US-SHRP project) >> > >> > Thanks >> > >> > Shimon Nesichi, M.Sc., >> > Managing Director, >> > Materials and Research Division, >> > Public Works Department, >> > Ben Zvi Rd. 55, POB 49057 >> > Tel Aviv, 61940 >> > Israel >> > >> -- >> Any resemblance of any of the above opinions to anybody's official >> position on anything is completely coincidental. >> ****************************************************************** >> >> Muriel Strand, P.E. >> Air Resources Engineer >> CA Air Resources Board >> 1001 I Street >> Sacramento, CA 95814 >> 916-324-6771 >> 916-322-3923 (fax) >> www.arb.ca.gov <http://www.arb.ca.gov/> > >