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This is the actual point I was making some time back i.e. if it doesn't fit with DP an individual can get it through FOI. It's a mess.......especially for us LAs who have to comply or be sued. On the one hand we get 40 days under DP and unstructured files which are harder to find comes under FOI (20 working days!) The nearer 1st January comes the more I am thinking "I'm a Council Worker - Get Me Outta Here"....only joking, but it is nearly Friday.
Doreen
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ian Welton [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2004 4:02 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Unstructured personal data
>
> ***** This email was received from the INTERNET *****
>
> Paul Ticher on 14 December 2004 at 12:40 said:-
>
> > They reply: Sorry, we can't
> > comply fully with
> > this Subject Access request for less than £450, so pay up or
> > get nothing.
>
> It sounds as though they do not consider the DPA 1998 £10 maximum SAR fees
> to be proper recompense for allowing you to assist them by checking if the
> data they hold about you is accurate.
>
> I hope you have advised them appropriately.
>
> Ian W
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection
> > issues [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
> > Paul Ticher
> > Sent: 14 December 2004 12:40
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: Re: Unstructured personal data
> >
> >
> > This interesting reply has caused me to think (and probably not very
> > clearly, at that).
> >
> > Scenario: I apply for Subject Access to a local authority
> > because I want to
> > check that a particular set of computerised records about me
> > is accurate. I
> > am prepared to pay the £10 fee, and I am not interested in
> > anything else.
> > However, it happens that the local authority also has a large
> > amount of
> > unstructured data about me. They reply: Sorry, we can't
> > comply fully with
> > this Subject Access request for less than £450, so pay up or
> > get nothing.
> >
> > That can't be right, so does it mean that, despite the FoIA
> > amending the
> > DPA, a DPA Subject Access request to a statutory body now has
> > to be split in
> > two: categories (a) to (d) for £10 regardless and category
> > (e) within the
> > £10 if it costs less than £450, otherwise subject to a
> > separate, possibly
> > substantial, fee?
> >
> > Paul Ticher
> > 0116 273 8191
> > 22 Stoughton Drive North, Leicester LE5 5UB
> >
> > I hereby require any recipient of this message not to use my
> > personal data
> > for direct marketing purposes.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Lynne Skipsey" <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 1:21 PM
> > Subject: Re: Unstructured personal data
> >
> >
> > > Just adding to Paul's explanation - my understanding is
> > that any personal
> > information falling into the additional 5th category (all
> > other recorded
> > info held by a public body) is covered by the new Fee
> > Regulations for FOI &
> > DPA (see attached). This means that public bodies receiving a
> > subject access
> > request from now on, will have to estimate whether the
> > personal data held in
> > unstructured manual systems/storage would cost more or less
> > than £450 to
> > provide and then proceed as follows:
> > > a) if it would cost less than £450 the public body has the
> > right to charge
> > additional costs to cover disbursements such as photocopying
> > and postage in
> > order to provide this information.
> > > b) if the volume of relevant personal data in unstructured
> > filing systems
> > would cost more than £450, (take more than 2 1/2 days) we
> > could refuse to
> > process this part of the request but it would be better if we
> > either i)
> > provided a limited amount within the > £450 threshold or
> > ii)charged full costs
> > for dealing with the request for personal data held in
> > unstructured manual
> > systems.
> > >
> > > Kind regards
> > >
> > > Lynne Skipsey
> > > Information Manager
> > > Registry - Corporate Services
> > > NHSU
> > > Tel 07775 508113
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
> > [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Paul Ticher
> > > Sent: 13 December 2004 13:04
> > > To: [log in to unmask]
> > > Subject: Re: [data-protection] Unstructured personal data
> > >
> > >
> > > No doubt others will correct me if I'm wrong, but I read it
> > that s.68 of
> > the Freedom of Information Act amends s.1(1)of the Data
> > Protection Act to
> > add a new fifth category of data: "recorded information held
> > by a public
> > authority [which] does not fall within any of paragraphs (a)
> > to (d)". In
> > effect, therefore, *all* recorded information held by a
> > public authority is
> > "data". If such data is also personal, it is therefore
> > personal data and
> > access would be available under the Data Protection Act, for
> > a fee of up to
> > £10, within 40 days and with the Data Protection Act
> > restrictions - access
> > would only be granted to the Data Subject and third party
> > confidentiality
> > would be protected, for example.
> > >
> > > If it is not personal - i.e, post-Durant, not *about* an
> > identifiable
> > living individual - it would not be personal data and
> > therefore access would
> > not be available under the Data Protection Act, but under the
> > Freedom of
> > Information Act, for free and with shorter time limits
> > provided the cost was
> > within the limits.
> > >
> > > Just thinking about how you would handle a collection which
> > contains a
> > mixture of personal and non-personal data makes me glad not
> > to be a public
> > authority DPO.
> > >
> > > Paul Ticher
> > > 0116 273 8191
> > > 22 Stoughton Drive North, Leicester LE5 5UB
> > >
> > > I hereby require any recipient of this message not to use
> > my personal data
> > for direct marketing purposes.
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Kirsty Gray" <[log in to unmask]>
> > > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > > Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 12:19 PM
> > > Subject: Unstructured personal data
> > >
> > >
> > > Now that the FOIA fees regs have been laid before
> > Parliament - anyone any
> > idea what we do about 'unstructured' personal data post 01/01/05?
> > >
> > > Reg 3 (the appropriate limit) "(1) This regulation has
> > effect to prescribe
> > the appropriate limit referred to in section 9A(3) and (4) of
> > the 1998 Act
> > ..." then goes on to confirm FOIA fees of £600 for central
> > government and
> > £450 for other public authorities.
> > >
> > > Reg 4 (estimating the cost of complying with a request -
> > general) "...a
> > relevant request is any request to the extent that it is a
> > request (a) for
> > unstructured personal data within the meaning of section
> > 9A(1) of the 1998
> > Act and to which section 7(1) of that Act would, apart from
> > the appropriate
> > limit, to any extent apply..."
> > >
> > > Does this mean that Durant is definately no longer applicable to the
> > public sector? Must we estimate total cost of complying with
> > a request for
> > unstructured personal data? And either respond (under the
> > limit) or choose
> > to refuse unless full cost paid (over the limit)? Can we charge
> > disbursements for responding (under the limit)? Is that as well as or
> > instead of £10 SAR fee?
> > >
> > >
> > > Has anyone seen any guidance from either DCA or ICO on this
> > one? My search
> > attempts this AM brought up nothing. Am I the only one
> > totally confused?
> > >
> > > Kirsty E Gray
> > > Access to Information Advisor
> > > Commission for Social Care Inspection>
> > >
> > > Note: comments for discussion and debate only and do not necessarily
> > reflect the corporate position of CSCI nor constitute legal advice.
> > >
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