I know you are addressing this to me. But I didn't understand a word.
Except about haircuts. Those are a useful metaphor for those who disagree
with our way of thinking, or who are outside the social norm, are they not?
By the way, further research shows that the quote I quoted about the good
pastor may well have been textually flawed. That does not prevent it from
being intellectually sound though
Now, if only I could tell whether you are telling me that you agree with me
or disagree with me, or "neither of the above" then I'd know how to answer
you ;)
-----Original Message-----
From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Ian Welton
Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004 12:33 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [data-protection] Fingerprinting schoolkids
There seems to be an inherent degree of confusion between privacy and the
public/private divide in many of the statements quoted.
Merely because data protection forges a link between the public/private
divide and privacy, drawing ALL of life into the political decision making
arena and therefore subject to political whims, merely indicates a certain
success of that particular social group and their current ideas regarding
the necessity for different forms of governance/coercive mechanisms.
Your statement on compliance raises the question - Is the ICO political?
That question could equally be - Is public life political?
A better question might be - what form of ideology does the social group
comprising the ICO's office follow as a group in their public work?
Issues regarding individual autonomy/decision making/personality seem to get
involved as attempts to change individual ideology via various governance
mechanisms intrude unchecked on the public individual. Dependent on role,
influence and position it would even be possible for intimacy not to be seen
as sacrosant in some circumstances, with respect and ethical issues merely
supporting intrusion in what could be termed a private sphere.
Now let worry commence when people start appearing with what are judged as
bad haircuts, after all they may not be a fashion trend after all, and will
undoubtedly be subject to the vagaries of personal perspectives. Where is
that pudding basin! :-)
Ian W
> -----Original Message-----
> From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Tim Trent
> Sent: 09 September 2004 11:28
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Fingerprinting schoolkids
>
>
> Of course you will still find you are overwhelmed by the "if you have
> nothing to hide you have nothing to fear" brigade. The Jews, of
> course, had nothing to fear, nor any reason to hide, until a nasty man
> with a bad haircut came along.
>
> Muslims in today's paranoid society "have nothing to fear and nothing
> to hide", except, of course, that they are Muslim and are this
> obviously all terrorists and to be hunted down and destroyed (if you
> believe US Rednecks).
> Homosexuals have, in the UK, had nothing to fear nor anything to hide
> since December 1967, except, of course, total discrimination in many
> workplaces.
>
> "They came for the Communists,
> and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Communist.
>
> Then they came for the Jews,
> and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
>
> Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I didn't speak out because
> I wasn't a Trade Unionist.
>
> Then they came for the Catholics,
> and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Catholic.
>
> Then they came for me,
> and there was no one left to speak out for me."
>
> - Pastor Martin Niemoller
>
> And yet we will be labelling people in interesting and strange manners
>
> http://www.joric.com/Conspiracy/1H-arm.htm
>
> George Orwell wrote 1984 with great wisdom. The TV Show is rightly
> called "Big Brother", yet we seem not to notice.
>
> Have any of you noticed that the Data Privacy regimes in old
> totalitarian states mean that they are first to be approved as SAFE to
> transfer data to from the EEA? They understand the abuses that a
> rotten regime can make of data.
>
> Oh, some of you will trivialise this. And this group was not set up
> as a "fighting group", simply as a learned discussion list. So
> perhaps this will be deemed "out of place". And yet privacy is
> privacy. And if we do for our own organisations what we are meant to
> do then it is up to us and people like us who have the real knowledge
> to make sure that abuses do not happen.
>
> So, back to the school: I remain certain that a complaint to TICO is
> necessary.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Simon Howarth
> (WSL)
> Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004 9:38 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [data-protection] Fingerprinting schoolkids
>
> >> Why not save time later and bar code everyone at birth :-)
>
> >That is logical!
>
> I used to be very much for ID cards, but now my views are changing
> fast. As I read this I immediately thought of the Jews being tattooed
> with a number for identification. Whilst I know the remark was
> jocular, this thought just plain frightens me!
>
> Simon Howarth.
>
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