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Adrian, I would not 'eagerly' await anything from the BMA, which should in my opinion stick to what it is good at (building a wine cellar and property investments). We do 6 fixed sessions all in office hours 1 for on call 1 for early starts/late finishes 3 Admin,travel teaching, management etc We would Consider 2:1 for evenings and 3:1 weekends Anyone who works plain time rates outside office hours undermines the case to be properly paid, obviously does not have any sense of self worth and if they feel the need to fulfil altruistic urges, they could always spare time to to work for a charity. So there!!!!! Paul -----Original Message----- From: Adrian Fogarty [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 05:43 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Fixed sessions out of hours As the strict definition of "fixed session" does not really apply to A&E, James, we have tended to interpret our "fixed" sessions as those where we must be on the shop floor (or thereabouts!). This essentially boils down to our resident evenings and weekends together with one or two of our standard days each week. As an example, I do every Monday evening from 4pm to 12mn, and this counts as (roughly) 2 sessions. I don't get any specific recompense for the lateness of the shift (but see later). I do three other standard day shifts, (Wed, Thur and Fri) each around 8 hours per day which equates (roughly) to 2 sessions per day. [So that's 8 sessions so far.] I also do one weekend a month, which is nominally 8 hours Sat and 8 hours Sun, although it's usually hard to restrict it to only 8 hours at the moment, but will be easier as new middle-grades come on board. This therefore equates to (roughly) 4 sessions per weekend, and, averaged over a month, this equates to 1 session per week. [So that's 9 sessions so far.] Then we add on 1 session for on-call from home, partly to cover after our "resident shifts" (when we are rarely called back), and partly to cover our registrars (which doesn't often happen now, and will decrease further when our 4th consultant starts next month, and rarely called anyway!). Finally we add on 1 session to compensate for antisocial hours, i.e. late shifts and weekends. [So that's 11 sessions in total.] We count the evening as 2 fixed, and the weekend as 1 fixed. We also count one-and-a-half of my standard 3 days as fixed, so that's 3 fixed sessions (the non-fixed sessions tend to be admin etc). So the total comes out at 6 fixed sessions out of a possible 11 sessions. I hope this makes sense. I'm sure some of you might suggest that we could get more time off in-lieu for our evenings and weekends, but I'm eagerly awaiting BMA negotiations on that point! And perhaps we don't claim enough sessions for our on-call from home, but we work a system where we are extremely rarely called from home, as there's generally someone "senior" actually in the department for the vast majority of the time. Adrian Fogarty A&E Consultant Royal Free Hospital ----- Original Message ----- From: "BINCHY Dr J, A&E Consultant" Subject: Fixed sessions out of hours Any consultants out there doing fixed clinical sessions in the evenings or at weekends? If yes what arrangements have you made with your trusts regarding extra payments or compensatory time off? I've been tasked by my local LNC to see what arrangements are operating around the country. If you'd like to discuss this off site I'm at mailto:[log in to unmask] James Binchy ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information in this e-mail and any attachments is confidential and is intended for the attention and use of the named addressee(s). It must not be disclosed to any other person without our authority. If you are not the intended recipient, or a person responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient or are aware that this e-mail has been sent to you in error, you are not authorised to and must not disclose, copy, distribute, or retain this message or any part of it. We sweep all outgoing messages for the presence of computer viruses. However, we cannot accept any responsibility for any loss or damage to your systems due to viruses or malicious code not detected. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the organisations within the Cornwall & Isles of Scilly Health Community ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------