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>Reply-To: For teachers and lecturers interested in curriculum issues affecting the te <[log in to unmask]> >To: [log in to unmask] >Subject: Chris Sivewright's posting - a topic of interest for sensible discussion? >Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:39:18 +0100 > >I am in correspondence with Chris on this. For those of you who have long >been members of the list, his views are - well - controversial. > >I offer the following summary - his words NOT MINE. > >If we are going to debate this issue lets all be sensible and professional. >For my own part, I am not sure what to think about the blurring of >examining, authoring and training activities. On the one hand you do get >'the inside story' when buying these products. > >But on the other hand what gets assessed gets taught. A very few people are >able to wield an enormous impact on the teaching and learning of our >subjects. I do not doubt they are every bit as interested in good practice, >but I worry about accountability and potential conflicts of interest. > >So Chris's posting > >QUOTE: Could this happen in the future - and would people be happy if it >did? or is the following a ground for concern? > >Mr A writes the A level Exam >Mr A teaches the A level subject and then examines it >Mr A runs a training company and that company could earn income from >training people to pass the exam that Mr A writes >Then...Mr A runs a training company that trains people to pass the exam >using the textbook that Mr A writes to pass the exam that Mr A Writes >Mr A advises the BBC on programmes that are for the exam, and he also runs a >training company that by now is training people to pass the exam using the >textbook that Mr A writes to pass the exam that Mr A Writes >Mr A advises the BBC on programmes that are for the exam, and he also runs a >training company that trains people to pass the exam using the textbook that >Mr A writes to pass the exam that Mr A Writes and Mr A then changes the exam >to make it a pre-issued case study >Mr A advises the BBC on programmes that are for the exam, and he also runs a >training company that trains people to pass the exam using the textbook that >Mr A writes to pass the exam that Mr A Writes and Mr A then changes the exam >to make it a pre-issued case study and people will no doubt buy guidance to >the exam i.e. 'possible questions' produced by the company that Mr A starts >Mr A advises the BBC on programmes that are for the exam, and he also runs a >training company that trains people to pass the exam using the textbook that >Mr A writes to pass the exam that Mr A Writes and Mr A then changes the exam >to make it a pre-issued case study and people then consider buying guidance >to the exam i.e. 'possible questions' produced by the company (as he ahs >spotted a market niche) that Mr A starts and Mr A also encourages his >friends to become examiners and write books on the exam that he writes >This leads on to: Mr A advises the BBC on programmes that are for the exam, >and he also runs a training company that trains people to pass the exam >using the textbook that Mr A writes to pass the exam that Mr A Writes and Mr >A then changes the exam to make it a pre-issued case study and people will >no doubt buy guidance to the exam i.e. 'possible questions' produced by the >company that Mr A starts and Mr A also encourages his friends to become >examiners and write books on the exam that he writes and these are all >favourably reviewed by the magazine that is edited and co-owned...by Mr A. >The website set up to extend Mr A's empire has copyright release to the >examination papers (something no other publisher has) giving it a market >edge and we're now one step nearer proscribed elarning..... >Of course this is all 'this could happen' - but what if it did? >List subscribers may like to consider these sites before they answer: >http://www.hodderheadline.co.uk/authordetails.asp?author=4475 >http://authorpages.hoddersystems.com/IanMarcouse/ >Colleagues may also like to consider whether such a similar thing could >happen in Economics...." >END QUOTE > > >Regards > >Richard Young >AST Teacher of Business Studies, Economics & ICT >Wood Green School >Woodstock Road >Witney OX28 1DX > >Tel 01993 702355 >Fax 01993 708662 > >www.woodgreen.oxon.sch.uk >BECTa/Guardian Secondary School Web Site of the Year 2001 >[log in to unmask] > > -----Original Message----- >From: For teachers and lecturers interested in curriculum issues >affecting the te [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf >Of Duncan Williamson >Sent: 30 June 2002 10:48 >To: [log in to unmask] >Subject: Re: Proposed changes to AS Business papers 1&2 ( AQA) > >We all know that Chris Sivewright is a live wire but I'd like to share >a view with everyone that I think provides clear guidance on what we >might expect from our examination boards. > >Firstly, you need to read Chris's post on the web site that Simon >pointed us at: essentially, it outlines a scenario that screams >conflict of interest and goodness knows what else! I have accepted as >fact everything that Chris has said even though he presents it as sort >of fictitious (there are links, though, that suggest otherwise!); so >what follows is a reflection of the posting on an as is basis. > >I am currently working on accounting education and training out here in >Central Asia and although my work centres around curriculum >development, materials development and training, I'd like to tell you >the process we have just gone through vis a vis our testing and >certification work. > >Our testing and certification work is being spearheaded by a man, Liam, >who was a very senior manager (marketing development) in the >Association of Certified Chartered Aaccountants (ACCA) (UK) and was CEO >of ACCA Ireland: he is a double qualified accountant (FCCA, ACMA) and >has a bachelor's degree (B Com) from an Irish university. He has worked >in the UK, Ireland, in many developing countries and whilst he was the >marketing development manager of the ACCA (UK) he travelled the world >advising accountants and accounting bodies on all aspects of their >work. These are his credentials and this is > >his approach to the problem that Chris has raised >the international accounting community's response to Liam's work > >Liam's rule 1: divorce testing and certification from all other >administrative activities >Liam's rule 2: divorce testing and certification from all teaching and >training activities >Liam's rule 3: divorce testing and certification from all materials >development activities >Liam's rule 4: employ only the most secure systems possible > >and so it goes on. We know that in this part of the world, the divorce >of testing and certification from all other activities is a vital >aspect of our work: until Liam and I arrived earlier this year there >was conflict and confusion of interests surrounding all aspects of >everyone's work and, surprise, surprise, we identified myriad problems >when we dug down into those conflicts and confusions. > >Even if people are not corrupt but their systems are badly constructed >and implemented, accidents happen and temptation is often too strong to >resist. > >At a conference this week, and subsequent administrative follow up >work, the following organisations endorsed our curriculum, training, >testing and certification work > >the American Institute of Certified Public Accountants (the world's >largest accounting body) >the International Accounting Standards Board (the world's premier >accounting standard setting body) >the Scottish Institute of Chartered Accountants (the world's first >accounting body and operator or Europe's largest business/accounting >training network) >the Institute of Management Accountants of the USA >the International Federation of Accountants (a federation of accounting >bodies from 156 countries and a major player in the world of accounting) > >It should be clear that with only a few exceptions, we are working with >the world's most important accounting organisations (forgive me if I >ask you not to think about Enron, WorldCom and Xerox for a moment!) > >The AICPA audited our curriculum and teaching and endorsed it; and they >audited our testing and certification work and endorsed it as being of >good quality, well managed and operated ... their key concerns surround >content and style of the exams, of course; the marking schemes and the >marking systems, of course; the security systems and procedures; and >the removal of all possible linkages from testing and certification to >all other aspects of our work. These latter two points are at the >forefront of the values that the AICPA concerns itself with and we >passed this aspect of their audit too. > >The IASB raised the same issues concerning standards of the tests and >the standards of the systems I have already mentioned ... so did all of >the other senior accountants at the conference. > >In terms of Chris Sivewright's concerns, Mr A would ABSOLUTELY NOT be >able to carry out in tandem many of the activities listed in Chris's >message: there are far too many conflicts of interest and potential >minefields in that list. > >Let me stress that I do not know Mr A, I have no personal axe to grind >in respect of any examinations board and the above is given purely to >reflect the ways that professional accounting organisations try to >ensure that their training, testing and certification work conforms to >the highest possible standards. We deserve the highest possible >standards for our GCSE and A level standards too, don't we. > > >Duncan Williamson > >PS As a matter of interest, if anyone is interested in the construction >of tests and so on, the AICPA is in the middle of a massive project to >transfer their testing regime from paper based (time constrained >exam ...) to computer based. A poor telephone link at the moment has >kept me away from their web site (www.aicpa.org) this week but you >might find some interesting things there. > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Simon Budgen >To: [log in to unmask] >Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2002 10:07 PM >Subject: Re: Proposed changes to AS Business papers 1&2 ( AQA) > > >An interesting if not controversial post to the TES Business Studies >message board by Mr Chris Siveweright! > >Follow the link: > >http://www.tes.co.uk/staffroom/thread.asp? >id=18108&threadID=26056&threadPage=1 > >ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø > >Simon Budgen > >[log in to unmask] > >ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø