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-----Original Message----- From: Laura Cao Romero [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 11:17 AM To: 'A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research.' Subject: RE: Fw: Outcome data De acuerdo (I agree on this very important issue) and I also send to all the list warm greetings from Mexico. Laura Cao Romero, midwife PS I intended to attend the Conference mentioned but couldn't. If there are papers written and published from it I would like to have access to them, you think its possible? -----Original Message----- From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of ddevane Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 11:05 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Fw: Outcome data Dear Ans I agree with you and the issues you raise make for interesting reading. Holly Powell Kennedy also addressed the issue of the 'optimality index' at the Normal Birth Research Conference in Preston in October and I like the idea of this. The only problem is that funders are very reluctant to come in behind non-morbidity' based indicators and I accept this as extremes of philosophy. If midwifery had as much recourse to medical colleagues, we might be well in a different position. Best wishes for a Happy Christmas. Declan Declan Devane, Doctoral Student / Midwifery Research Assistant, School of Nursing and Midwifery Studies, University of Dublin Trinity College, Trinity Centre for Health Sciences Education, St. James's Hospital, Dublin 8. Tel: 087 659 6923 Email: [log in to unmask] ******************************************* Please note that electronic mail to, from or within Trinity College may be the subject of a request under the Freedom of Information Act ******************************************* -----Original Message----- From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health research. [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of luyben Sent: 20 December 2002 16:50 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Fw: Outcome data Dear Declan, You talk about "safety", which is a very professionalised, maybe even medicalised expression, or even indicator of midwifery care. I am not quite sure yet; I am doing a cross cultural study and somebody just "gave" this to me. Concerning antenatal care I have a concept called "Feeling sure". Although there is an article called " Safe passage" and people also talked about "safety". In Switzerland somebody said to me Sicherheit kriegen, which could be translated as Getting safety/ security OR as transfering a level of expertise, something like Getting experience/ certainty. This make me open my eyes. So there could be a passive and an active meaning of this word. The midwifery sense might be more like the second one, with a bit of the first ( it is not about protection, they said). With regards, Ans Luyben Chur, Switzerland ----- Original Message ----- From: "ddevane" <[log in to unmask]> To: <[log in to unmask]> Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 10:56 AM Subject: Re: Fw: Outcome data > Jane/Rosalee > > I agree with Rosalee that there is a great deal of difficulty in > differentiating between medical and midwifery outcomes and indeed there is > also differentiation within midwifery and obstetrics themselves. The > concept of 'safety' for example, is an ambiguous definition with the > indicators of same varying depending on the professional/lay person asked > and the perspective they hold. A medical colleague and I are conducting a > study, the purpose of which is to elicit indicators for maternal and > neonatal 'safety'. At the moment discussions range from PNDepression to PPH > to breast feeding to mode of delivery etc. > > We talk of safety but there is little to define what we mean by this fuzzy > concept. > > Happy Christmas to all > > Regards > > > Declan > > Declan Devane, > Doctoral Student / Midwifery Research Assistant, > School of Nursing and Midwifery Studies, > University of Dublin Trinity College, > Trinity Centre for Health Sciences Education, > St. James's Hospital, > Dublin 8. > Tel: 087 659 6923 > Email: [log in to unmask] > > ******************************************* > Please note that electronic mail to, > from or within Trinity College may be > the subject of a request under the > Freedom of Information Act > ******************************************* > > > -----Original Message----- > From: A forum for discussion on midwifery and reproductive health > research. [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Rosalee > Shaw > Sent: 17 December 2002 22:38 > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: Fw: Outcome data > > > Jane, my doctoral work was looking at midwifery indicators and outcomes. > Although the work is yet unfinished, I would be happy to discuss it further. > > There is a deal of difficulty in differentiating between medical and > midwifery outcomes, and I found that for both of these groups the ultimate > outcome is "healthy mother, healthy baby" and the indicators linked to this. > The main difference between midwifery and medicine is not in the ultimate > aim, but in the process, and so I am finding that process indicators are > much more relevant, e.g. the use of chemical pain management is one example. > > Happy to discuss this further if its useful. > Rosalee > > >>> [log in to unmask] 12/17/02 06:33PM >>> > I have forwarded this message on behalf of a query to ICM. Please send > replies to list and I will collate, and return to the list and the original > sender. > Jane Sandall - list moderator > > -----Original Message----- > > > Pam McQuide and I are working on a paper re: nursing and midwifery outcomes. > Do you have any recommendations regarding literature of midwifery outcomes > or cost comparisons across different types of care providers. Finding good > conclusive studies in the literature has been difficult. > > Any suggestions would be welcome. Thanks for your help. Judy >