Cliff, I dont know the official Australasian position, but certain high ranking Fellows have at various times expressed strong opposition to any suggestion that any of these courses are made compulsary, for all the reasons you mention. Currently none are. My personal view is much the same as yours, with the possible exception of APLS. My own reasoning for this is that coming up to the end of my training I have dealt with several hundred adult major trauma's and over a hundred cardiac arrests. When it comes to kids Ive done maybe 20-25 major trauma's and 12 arrests. Hence I see much greater value in APLS, than ATLS or ALS. That said all the skills taught on an APLS course should be well taught during an ED training programme - but the rarity of really sick kids to most trainees increases its potential usefulness. Craig (Conflict of interest : APLS instructor !) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp